I suck with women so much, long post, need help and lots of it

[selke]

Never been good with women. In the past 5 years I've had 3 girlfriends both last under 6 months. I'm not a really social guy so that's my problem. As I get older I see my friends get into serious relationships and I really want that, but I'm just so bad when it comes to speaking to a girl, I don't even want to try anymore. Hell my best friend is having a kid with his girlfriend of 3 years. That's some scary shit right there.

I'm 20, still a virgin. I don't even care about the fact I'm a virgin, and this freaks out some of my buddies. I seriously want a girl that I can talk to about anything, just cuddle with, and hold her and all that shit and the sex will come eventually.

One night stand seems really fun and I'll definitely do it if the opportunity ever comes...but I don't have high hopes for that.

Before I get into a relationship, I guess I gotta start talking to girls. I'm so bad at that. I can never keep a conversation going. I don't want to talk about boring stuff either. I can tell when I'm not interesting a girl with what I'm saying and I'll usually change the subject right after. What do girls like talking about. I know they love talkng about themselves, but how do I bring that up? How was your day? that stuff gets old and I can't repeat it all the time. I need tips on how to have a decent conversation with women. A good conversation, nothing meaningless.

I know a few girls, and I get put into the friend zone, which for any guy trying to get a relationship, the friend zone is pure evil. I hate the friend zone. You can never get out of the friend zone, and if there is a way, which I seriously doubt, but if there is a way....the guy who does it is a God that needs to be worshiped.


Right now I'm interested in this girl, I really like her. I don't know how to tell her. Even if I did, I know for a fact she doesn't like me. For one, I see her about twice a month. But she is so beautiful, so friendly, so nice, I can't stop thinking about her and I look forward to every chance I have to spend time with her. We met in the summer through friends of friends and she started hanging out with my friends and I started hanging out with hers and spent a lot of time together, but she's in school and I'm at school, and with work and our schedules and social lives it's hard to meet up now. We got pretty close in the summer, she asked me to spend the night over after a party, but she was drunk and I didn't want to take advantage of the fact she was. Was it gonna get me laid, probably. At the time I didn't really have any feelings for her. And I had very important work things to do so I couldn't spend the night or I would have. Looking back, I'm the biggest idiot in the world. I could have spent some quality time talking to her and comforting her or something.

We communicate through text messages every few days, and I love that. It's the only way of communicating with her. I'd love to call her and just hang out. Like I said, schedules and all, it's tough. How do I ask her to hang out and not make it seem like a date? When I see her it's usually in a group of people. Never one on one time.

The problem I have with this girl is she's too socially advanced for me. By that I mean she knows too many people. I'm limited with my friends, I have my friends and some people I talk to, but this girl knows EVERYBODY. What shot do I have? When I'm not with her I have no idea who she's with, which is normal, but I don't know if she likes some dude or how many dudes like her. Hell, if I like her and I barely know her, she must have a bunch of guys like her. All I know is that she's single and looking for a boyfriend.

What do I even say to this girl? We talk about the everyday stuff, but I want to get to know her as a person and I want her to get to know me. I want to have a good conversation with her. At the same time I don't want it to be obvious that I like her, at least not right now. How do I handle myself in front of her to be friendly and for her to enjoy the time she spends with me? What kind of things can I talk about, what can I do?

I'm really bad with women, really bad. I love women so much, but I just can't get myself to be good with them. What in the **** do I do?

Women, give me all the help you can give me, I really need it.
Men, laugh at me, tell me how to man up.

[NeoSeminole]

never ask a female for advice on females. You're just setting yourself up for disaster. If you want to become successful with girls, then you need to learn how to generate chemistry. I suggest you look into PUA material. It breaks down the whole process of attraction so you can learn from it before testing the field.

[Chupacabras]

Why would you want to hang out and not make it seem like a date? That's the fastest way there is into the friend zone, though chances are you probably are already there with her.

I'm all for learning kino to generate chemistry but the PUA stuff is kinda sketchy if you're looking for long term. Regardless, you need to learn how to keep a conversation going with a woman; believe it or not most guys don't find this comes naturally, you have to learn and practice it.

Listen to women and you'll get a whole lot of you're adorable and the right girl will come along which just isn't true. You've got to not only meet a lot of them but also date, date and date some more and make sure it's well known from the get-go that you want to eventually put your penis in them. That sensitive hoverer crap doesn't work, unless you're looking to be the platonic shoulder she cries on.

[bloodtippedrose]

yeah, no comforting her unless youre feeling her up at the same time.
doing what youre doing now isnt working. so try the opposite. Go pinch someones ass.

[selke]

what's PUA?

Alright how do I change my attitude towards her? And really, I wouldn't mind being the "platonic shoulder she cries on". I just want to spend time with this girl.

Of course I wouldn't mind going out with her.


How do I give her a few hints that's I'm interested without making it fully obvious?

[Gigabitch]

Oh, for Christ's sake.

Did you see the movie Waiting? You're Calvin. Stop it. You need to grow a pair and get laid. Your perceived value to women is almost nil- do something about this. She doesn't need another girlfriend or a platonic shoulder to cry on, believe me.

You remind me of this guy I knew when I was 19. He was desperately in love with me, tall, dark and handsome, brilliant, and could very easily have stolen me from my boyfriend at the time (who was an absolute chode) but he was a TOTAL PUSSY. He was my platonic shoulder. He bought me lunch and lifted heavy things for me and listened to me whinging about my boyfriend when he really should have been demanding that I dump the jackass and go to bed with him.

I totally would have, but I didn't. Why? Because he came off as being weak and pathetic. Like you.

[selke]

Oh, for Christ's sake.

Did you see the movie Waiting? You're Calvin. Stop it. You need to grow a pair and get laid. Your perceived value to women is almost nil- do something about this. She doesn't need another girlfriend or a platonic shoulder to cry on, believe me.

You remind me of this guy I knew when I was 19. He was desperately in love with me, tall, dark and handsome, brilliant, and could very easily have stolen me from my boyfriend at the time (who was an absolute chode) but he was a TOTAL PUSSY. He was my platonic shoulder. He bought me lunch and lifted heavy things for me and listened to me whinging about my boyfriend when he really should have been demanding that I dump the jackass and go to bed with him.

I totally would have, but I didn't. Why? Because he came off as being weak and pathetic. Like you.

The thing is I don't know how to change. It's just not in my character to do so. I need tips. But thanks for saying it like it is.

[Gigabitch]

I think if you started seeing what different behavior would do for you, it WOULD become part of your nature.

Do you want a soggy t-shirt shoulder or a blowjob? See what I'm saying?

[IndiReloaded]

The PUA stuff has some concepts about confidence that could help, but save your money. The player tek-neeks fail as much as they work and tend to select for women who are too clueless to know or care when someone is trying to manipulate them. Those guys get their chops busted all the time, and few players know how to gain (or want) commitment from a girl. I have a great personal story I'll post sometime about a guy who tried this PUA stuff on me in a pub.

Giga told you what is, now you need solid ideas on how to change & evoke confidence. I thought this site has some good tips:

[url]http://www.wikihow.com/Be-Confident[/url]

[johnboy12]

Look here's the thing. Your brought up by women to be nice, ie polite etc. This translates into not being forward or direct. So despite what women tell you they always are attracted to the opposite. Here's how it works. Women have a few triggers, hit the funny bone, be direct, ask for sex, be COOL about it, act comfortable, be slightly aloof and always make a move to get her in bed.

If she says yes great, if she say's no, at least she knows your interested. If you want to be friends be friends..but dont be friends if you want to have a relationship later.. Women are really pretty much abusive in this category. TRUST ME. This is an observation. I'm not bitter. Now notice I said if you want her as a love interest, if your truly just friends thats very cool. DON'T MIX THE 2.

[NeoSeminole]

I got 2 numbers tonight while you probably sat at home crying while jacking off to porn. The difference between you and me? I open myself up to the possibility of rejection. You have to fail a few times in order to succeed. You may never get rejected if you don't talk to them, but you will never get a girl this way either.

[selke]

I got 2 numbers tonight while you probably sat at home crying while jacking off to porn. The difference between you and me? I open myself up to the possibility of rejection. You have to fail a few times in order to succeed. You may never get rejected if you don't talk to them, but you will never get a girl this way either.

Well actually I was with her and a few other friends, and I asked her to go shopping with me for a female perspective and she agreed. So I finally get to spend some one on one time with her.

Now that's another problem. I hate shopping. Whatever at least I have the chance to spend some time with her.

And what exactly does it mean when she says that I can call her at any time of the day and she'll hang out? Does she actually mean it or is this shit girls say? How soon can I test this to see if she's bullshitting or not?

[Gigabitch]

How is that more important than kissing her? Stop distracting yourself. Get down to business, and by business, I mean touching.

Call her up and tell her you sprained your shoulder (the tear-soaked one). If she offers to come over and take care of you, make damned sure you get a backrub out of it.

[Chupacabras]

You asked her to go shopping? She's serious about calling any time and she'll hang out, because you're one of her girlfriends now.

What you just did? Next girl you're interested in, do the exact opposite.

[selke]

oh yea i'm definitely in the friendzone after the shopping question. i can't even deny that fact anymore. i guess shit happens.
i texted her about the shopping thing and she's "looking forward to it" and said we should get drinks after she finishes work that day.