Western and non Western girls

[qwertz]

wow, i think i better get comfy before i sit and read through the marathon posts!

[IndiReloaded]

Its simply a respect for others. That's the quality you want, Mish. That quality starts with respect for self, which is often taught in the family/home environment. So many people don't even respect themselves, which isn't the same thing as being egotistical.

Western culture has been numbed to these qualities. I blame television and unrealistic expectations about life in general. Tolerance is an almost unheard concept, yet we are just as flawed as we were a decade or a century ago. The concept of personal responsibility has been mangled to mean that we do whatever we want, for our own reasons, and its up to other people to stand up for themselves. Chaos and alienation results. Almost nobody trusts anyone to care about others except their own microcosm (maybe, even that's not guaranteed) anymore.

Personal responsibility also means that people imagine how their actions affect others. This doesn't mean you are a doormat and people can do what they like, but that there are standards that are kept and held for everyone that we interact with.

[vashti]

vashti says:

"It strikes me as odd that so many men need their women to feign submissiveness in order to feel like a man. Women of all cultures learn how to wield their power, if not blatantly, then covertly. You can't expect 50% of the world population to be happy about not having any autonomy."

weak men need a women to "feign submissiveness" to make themselves feel manly. Strong men want a woman who knows her role and won't tolerate inequality (e.g. girls who think it's okay to share the 'girl chores' while the man does all the guy chores).

I'm cool with sharing all the chores except laundry. I don't want a man washing my clothes ever.

Also, I don't call them "girl chores" or "man chores"... all work needs to be done by whomever is capable and has time. Chores really haven't ever been an issue in my home.

Still, I say most women don't mind letting the man lead if they trust that he knows what he is doing. All too often though, he doesn't.

[IndiReloaded]

Still, I say most women don't mind letting the man lead if they trust that he knows what he is doing. All too often though, he doesn't.

I wouldn't say they don't know how to. They do it to different standards. In my experience, anyway.

'Man standards' are generally 'good enough' and emphasize volume and improvement over details.

'Woman standards' are generally higher in the details and tend to be nice rather than necessary.

Unless it involves money, sex or war. In those cases men tend to own women on the details, largely due to a better force of will.