Interesting question

[misombra]

I thought you guys would be a bit more..hmm..deep.

since when does deep mean incomprehensible?

oh wait, you don't have to answer. that's how pseudo-intellectuals do it.

[PUN-ish]

It's incomprehensible to minds that don't reflect too often. Pseudo-intellectual? Try "being real".

You won't engage a conversation with someone that doesn't attract you.
As I see it, instead of looking firstly for someone who you love for his/her worth, you look for someone who attracts you.
Instead of eliminating people according to their personality and worth, you eliminate according to their physique. You're not interested in a person, your interested in his/her body above all. SECONDLY, you get to know the person inside that body. That's ugly, that's no love.

[vashti]

What is your issue, PUNish? Do you think you are unattractive? Rather than ruminate in all the ways the rest of the world is flawed, perhaps you should try to improve yourself. You would certainly end up with better results. THAT is "being real".

[TheSphinx]

It's incomprehensible to minds that don't reflect too often. Pseudo-intellectual? Try "being real".

You won't engage a conversation with someone that doesn't attract you.
As I see it, instead of looking firstly for someone who you love for his/her worth, you look for someone who attracts you.
Instead of eliminating people according to their personality and worth, you eliminate according to their physique. You're not interested in a person, your interested in his/her body above all. SECONDLY, you get to know the person inside that body. That's ugly, that's no love.

To me, your ideal sounds more like friendship than love.

I know a few really ugly guys who date gorgeous women despite this supposed "rule." Looks be damned. Is that "fair" to all of the guys with Grecian physiques? I'm sure that some of them feel it isn't.

Why get bent out of shape because other people choose partners in a different manner than what you prefer? If you choose to view the world in this manner, you will experience it as such. You will most likely miss out on all of the women who are attracted to you and value your personality.

~Sphinx

[PUN-ish]

->What is your issue, PUNish? Do you think you are unattractive? Rather than ruminate in all the ways the rest of the world is flawed, perhaps you should try to improve yourself. You would certainly end up with better results. THAT is "being real".

So, did I say something true? Don't we aim for outer beauty than inner beauty? Isn't your "solution" reflecting what I was talking about? And btw, I got the results I need. I don't have to improve anything about my looks or w/e so that superficial people notice me. "Being real" involves reason, not living a lie.

And also, how is it that people "in love" find their partner the best partner in the world AFTER they get to know them and NOT after looking at them?

->If you choose to view the world in this manner, you will experience it as such. You will most likely miss out on all of the women who are attracted to you and value your personality.

Usually, when I have an opinion on something, I ask myself if everyone had that mindset, would people be living in peace and harmony? And seriously, I think if people would leave their fantasies and their instincts on the side (when looking for a partner, theses needs can be fulfilled with that specific partner) they would be better fathers and mothers. Look at the divorce rates; theses people don't seem to have a mindset any different than the typical "normal" mindset you find in this forum. You find it normal? +To me, your ideal sounds more like lust than love. What is love without friendship anyways?

And about the hotty who can't seem to find a partner, my point wasn't to stress on the fairness of the situation. I was trying to say that either way, outer beauty is going to vanish one day or another. Like my math teacher once said "Gravity always wins (vs breasts)"

[TheSphinx]

And seriously, I think if people would leave their fantasies and their instincts on the side (when looking for a partner, theses needs can be fulfilled with that specific partner) they would be better fathers and mothers.

What I'm saying is that there could possibly be women out there who are attracted to you by their instincts. If you never meet these women because they are "shallow," how will you ever get to know their personalities and decide if you would like a romantic relationship with them?

I'm not trying to knock the value of personality. I will meet a cute woman and bail a minute later if she doesn't have much going on in that department.

And I know that you feel that they should seek your personality first, but explain how a person would go about in this order. You would have to meet and experience every woman that you met. Every single one, because you cannot experience a person's "full" personality (to your satisfaction) simply by observing them.

To me, your ideal sounds more like lust than love. What is love without friendship anyways?

So you would agree that there exists something more than friendship in love, right?

Would you agree that a missing element could be sexual attraction(lust)?

If so, then instinct is a huge part of it!

Can you make yourself sexually attracted to anything? Could you, yourself, honestly make yourself sexually attracted to a stump, a sloth, or your grandmother?

Sex can be a powerful bonding agent. I can't see how a relationship, let alone procreation could take place without it.

~Sphinx

[PUN-ish]

Lust will come by itself if you love a person for who they are.
Isn't that the reason *alot* of people fall in love with their good friends (opposite sex)?

->If you never meet these women because they are "shallow," how will you ever get to know their personalities and decide if you would like a romantic relationship with them?

Actually, I don't classify people according to their looks. I try, yes I try because it is hard, to give everyone the same worth. We are all equal right? It might sound too serious/moral, but I think it's worth the outcome. A georgous babe might also have a fantastic personality, why not? But that doesn't give me the right to dismiss people that don't attract me initially right? Don't get me wrong, we guys love the curves. Girls wear heels for a reason. But at the end, what are we looking for?

[TheSphinx]

Lust will come by itself if you love a person for who they are.
Isn't that the reason *alot* of people fall in love with their good friends (opposite sex)?

I think either one or both of the people who are in love with their good friends started out attracted to them.

We are all equal right? It might sound too serious/moral, but I think it's worth the outcome. A georgous babe might also have a fantastic personality, why not? But that doesn't give me the right to dismiss people that don't attract me initially right?

Nope. Maybe we're guaranteed equal protection and equal rights here in the states and some other countries, but we're not all dealt the same hand in terms of attributes. If someone doesn't attract you, it's up to you as to whether you dismiss them or not. I'm not going to waste my time pursuing a relationship with someone I am unable to be sexually attracted to, nor waste their time with such.

But at the end, what are we looking for?

Must be looks, wealth, family, etc. if personality is supposed to come first.

~Sphinx

[vashti]

I know you think you are morally superior for pretending that looks serve absolutely no purpose, but I would just like to say that as a woman, I would not be remotely interested in dating someone who didn't find me attractive. I already know about my internal qualities... I want a man to look at me like I am a woman.

[misombra]

i saw my sister for christmas and she has lost a lot of weight. she was bragging about wearing size four and how she only eats some rice during the day or whatever. she was so proud of herself.

i said to myself that night, "you might be nice and thin now, but you're still ugly. inside and out."

[PUN-ish]

->I know you think you are morally superior for pretending that looks serve absolutely no purpose, but I would just like to say that as a woman, I would not be remotely interested in dating someone who didn't find me attractive. I already know about my internal qualities... I want a man to look at me like I am a woman.

Ah, of course. That's where all the cute words come into play . I'm 100% with you on this one. Love and the attraction has to be sustained, not consumed.

You will become sexually attracted to someone if you end up liking that person's personality.
Perhaps you did find one of your previous partners sexy and now, you find them not so sexy after all. amirite? Human nature. Love blinds.

[vashti]

As tightly as you are clinging to your sense of superiority, I am quite convinced you find yourself unattractive.

[PUN-ish]

Not superiority, more like, thoughtful and caring. I hate arrogance.

That question you asked me is interesting. I could say I'm average looking. Maybe more than average, maybe less. All I know though, I think what makes me less attractive is perhaps my lack of care about my clothes/hair products/w/e. I don't try to be that sexy romeo because well, I can't find a reason to be like that. It wouldn't be me. I wear "normal" clothes and am an A+ student hygiene-wise. I have been told about both the hygiene and the clothes thingy.

I'm the different kind of guy. I'm very open, yet very religious. Very emotional, romantic too. Every girl's dream (?) . I also don't know what being shy is.

The good guy right? They get missed out as usual xD

I got told that I would make a great husband and father and that I'm very respectful towards others. That's more than enough for me.

But it is certainly smart of you for asking me about my attractiveness. My ideas about theses stuff is fueled by what I see, hear and experience.

[vashti]

I think you need to work on your self confidence. Nice guys are attractive to women when they have confidence.

[PUN-ish]

Perhaps. But like I said, I don't feel shy in front of any girl. I don't have any problems socially. I can chat for hours with people of any age.
I think, do enlighten me about this, being too kind and sweet/too ez to get removes the attractivness, am I mistaken?