Is It An Emotional Affair? What Does It Mean to Him?

[Primo]

Glad to hear your having a good time loriloo, hopefully it's making him think about what life may be like without you and he'll have a different attitude when you get back.

Hopefully he's aware enough now to know that he's going to have to be completely honest and open with you about the reason he sought comfort in this other woman without you knowing. But you have to always be prepared that some people, even those you love dearly, and that perhaps love you just as much will still sacrifice everything, including those they love to keep their secrets.

[IndiReloaded]

Are you an anthropologist? I went to school for anthro for many years....

Scientist. Biochem and molecular. Critical thinking is good no matter what discipline. I've used it for teaching kinesiology students also. Good luck with the counselling.

[loriloo]

Primo - is it truly love if one sacrifices that person to keep secrets? And after he has been caught red handed, why continue to keep secrets? To keep from hurting his partner even further? To keep from looking like a total cad? Fear? Embarrassment? Why not just 'fess up while he has an out - lay your cards on the table and see what turns up? He's already crushed my heart so if he is trying to protect my feelings the point is moot. Seems like he would want to get it all out so he doesn't get caught again somewhere down the road. I will never understand human nature...or how men think??? Maybe women do this too.

It seems as though just when you think you know someone really well they will do something to prove that you don't really know them at all. Maybe it's just a matter of how you perceive someone and your expectations of them and when they behave badly your view of that person is distorted thus making you feel majorly disappointed. I don't know if that makes sense....

Anyway, he keeps calling and the voice mail messages are piling up. He wants me to come home and has asked me not to see anyone else. Like I said before that's the furthest thing from my mind. And when I go home I believe that he will cruise along like before and won't even acknowledge there is a problem. What I really want is for him to talk to me about what has happened and tell me WHY. And then like Indi suggested go to counseling with me. BTW he has offered to send me more money. It's like he is trying to buy back my affection. I wish he would have spent this much effort before I left.

Indi -Cool - a biochem and molecular scientist? No wonder you like the scientific method. :-) I always said that archaeology (my area of anthropology) has physics envy because it's not a real science or as one of my professors once said "archaeology is destruction and cannot be replicated so do it right the first time"!

[Mish]

AThe other woman asked him to never contact her again when she found out he was telling others they were sleeping together (which was wishful thinking on his part).

I think the fact that he was openly telling (lying to) other people that he was sleeping with her casts a shadow on his intentions. It seems like the only reason he didn't physically cheat on you is because the other woman didn't put out for him.

What does this mean? It means he has no respect for you or your relationship.

[IndiReloaded]

Archaeology is cool. You have to have a lot of patience for it. I've been to Housteads and the Alberta badlands, that's some pretty neat work.

So, with anthropology in the mix, does this mean I've met someone who can finally explain the different hominids to me? I used to keep up w/my National Geographic subscription, but then Lucy got changed or demoted or something, and it all started sounding the same--hominid, hominane...etc. Like conjugating a verb.

[loriloo]

Mishanya - I am beginning to see that it means he has no respect for me and our relationship and that is pretty much devastating to me. The whole thing has been devastating from from his need to go elsewhere to the lying to the betrayal. It also seems that he has no respect for himself too. Why would he sneak around, lie, cover his tracks, knowingly crush my feelings and risk losing me if he respected himself? I mean if you have any self worth at all, wouldn't you be morally above all that? If he had a problem with the state of our relationship wouldn't he have discussed it with me or at the least left the relationship before turning to another woman - if he had self respect? It really hurts to know that he disrespected me that way when I have always respected him as I said earlier both personally and professionally. I always thought he did the same for me too and it feels awful to know he didn't. The really hard part is to know that it might not ever be recaptured and to just let it go. The trust between us has been broken and I feel totally betrayed.

Indi - archaeology is cool and it can try one's patience too...I really don't work in archaeology any more because jobs are so rare and the competition is fierce. Most archaeologists are so competitive because there is no one accepted hypothesis (note I didn't say theory) so everyone wants to be viewed as being correct. There is a Monty Python skit that says it all, where archaeologists are bragging how much taller they are than the other until their assertions get so ridiculous they end up being taller than trees. :-)

As for the hominid thing, it's almost impossible to keep up with the research because new evidence pops up almost daily. Small brain and small teeth, small brain and large teeth, small brain and very large teeth, large brain and small teeth with various modes of quadrupedalism and bipedalism thrown in the mix...what is most interesting to me is the independent evolution of traits and/or invention of utility that have occurred in different/separate places in the world (for example Asia and Europe) in approximately the same time frame. I guess humans were destined to be what they are no matter which part of the world they developed in.

Even after studying anthro for 9+ years in school, I still don't understand human nature. Maybe I should have studied psychology instead...sort of wish I would have gone into a different field of study because I met my guy while were were both undergrad anthro students......we were together through grad school and for many years after. One of the great things about our relationship was the bond and common interest of having the same degree and helping each other with our careers. He is a professor of archaeology and a curator of archaeology for a local museum (I have shifted my focus to architectural history and work as a consultant). At least I thought it was important to him too. Guess I was wrong....

[Primo]

Primo - is it truly love if one sacrifices that person to keep secrets? After he has been caught red handed, why continue to keep secrets? To keep from hurting his partner even further? To keep from looking like a total cad? Fear? Embarrassment?

It's not the kind of love that you thought you had, that's for sure. Making someone's world close in around them by not telling them things you know they don't want to hear, that you know will devastate them is love too, protecting someone you care about deeply from hurt. But unfortunately it's not fair when you're involved in what's supposed to be a lifelong relationship. I wish we could pull a "Freaky Friday" so that you could see this, know what's going on from a man's perspective, I really do.

Mishanya made a great post, something I'd avoided because I knew you were suffering from this situation already and didn't want to add to the pain. There is no question that there is something missing in his life, from a male/female relationship perspective that he's not getting from you. For some reason he's not opening up to you about it. It's not physical appearance, because the person he wanted wasn't a knockout so to speak. But when you look at the evidence, it's pointing to some form of intimacy that's missing on his part. There's no question in my mind that he loves you :-) In love with you? Well only he knows. I think GB made a very good post about being the woman in his house, not in his heart at this point.

It's good that he cares about what you're doing out there, who you're with. The male ego is a strange thing though, being concerned that you're not getting drilled into an orgasmic frenzy 3 times a day by some stud out there is just one of those guy things :-P Unfortunately it speaks little from our hearts. I truly hope that he opens up to you and tells you what he's lacking in your relationship, because it is something and it appears to revolve around intimacy. I'm not holding out much hope for couseling, because if he won't be open and honest one on one with you, his lover, he certainly won't do it in front of a stranger.

There's definitely hope lori, if he admits to you what's missing and it's still something you can and want to provide, or something he still wants from you, not another woman, it can be done. There's always the possibility things will never be the same, that's apparently something he's willing to accept by not opening up already, but can you?

Though all situations are different, I can speak to you from experience on this one, I'm not just giving you hypothetical scenarios and my opinion. It's hard to cover it all on a message board, and this is a pot of coffee situation to talk over, not a cup :-P but you did the right thing by walking away and letting him know you're not afraid to be strong and independent.

[IndiReloaded]

Oh God. He's an academic. This mindset is different from the standard flavour out there.

Lori, I can completely understand that he had this e-affair and is now probably regretting it. His current behaviour says he still cares. In the sometimes messed-up ways that guys who live in their heads all day do.

In an ideal world, what is it you want from him. What kind of resolution would make you okay with moving forward from everything, assuming you both want to?

This^ is the kind of thing to discuss with the counsellor. I've been married a loooong time, also to a guy who lives in his head. Guys like this need to be set on a path, with clear goals. No doubt you two have settled into bad communication patterns that could be improved.

I am assuming you two are otherwise compatible and genuinely care about each other. On the days when you don't want to hit each other with a shovel and bury your partner in the back yard. This kind of fluctuation in a LTR or marriage is completely normal for the length of time you've been together. Its possible to get back on track. Just a point for perspective. Check out this sticky and see if it resonates with the two of you:

[url]http://www.loveforum.net/love-advice-forum/28296-stages-marriage-long-term-relationship.html[/url]

[Mish]

Mishanya - I am beginning to see that it means he has no respect for me and our relationship and that is pretty much devastating to me. The whole thing has been devastating from from his need to go elsewhere to the lying to the betrayal. It also seems that he has no respect for himself too. Why would he sneak around, lie, cover his tracks, knowingly crush my feelings and risk losing me if he respected himself? I mean if you have any self worth at all, wouldn't you be morally above all that? If he had a problem with the state of our relationship wouldn't he have discussed it with me or at the least left the relationship before turning to another woman - if he had self respect? It really hurts to know that he disrespected me that way when I have always respected him as I said earlier both personally and professionally. I always thought he did the same for me too and it feels awful to know he didn't. The really hard part is to know that it might not ever be recaptured and to just let it go. The trust between us has been broken and I feel totally betrayed.

I think it's possible to have little to no respect for both relationship and a partner yet at the same time have (some type of) respect for one's self.

Relationships get less exciting after awhile. They provide stability, but the excitement is not the same as it used to be. Some people yearn for that excitement. In a perfect world where both partners respect and understand each other, communication is open and the person lets his partner know about these things and they either work on this issue together or let each other go before any trespasses happen. But in a less perfect relationship lacking not only excitement, but also respect the partner can well deem that perpetual excitement is something they deserve and they will take whatever steps necessarily to ensure it happens, disregarding any feelings their significant other may have on the matter.

[loriloo]

OK. This is getting confusing...I've read over all the posts from the beginning and there are so many different things being said that I feel overwhelmed!

First, I want to say that I had been thinking of getting away for a few days before I put up my first post and when Primo suggested it, I decided it was a great idea and it was time to do it - so I did. I had been kinda frozen in my tracks and was unsure about what to do because I was (am) emotionally devastated. Primo - thanks for being the catapult I needed. You have been very kind and I appreciate your thoughtfulness.

Second, it's apparent that I would like to work through this with my partner. It may be hard for someone else to understand this, but I am in love with him. We have never gone through something this difficult before in 15 years and I would hope that if the tables were turned that he would give me a second chance. Maybe in the end he will not want to work things out with me, but I would like to give it a shot. I am not condoning his behavior nor will it be easy to forgive him. I know I will definitely never forget it. It will probably always be in the back of my mind as I feel betrayed and don't trust him right now (if ever?). I am crushed by his betrayal of our cosmic connection and at the same time mad as hll - how dare he do this after the devotion I have given to us as a couple. I will just have to trust that the universe will help me sort this out in time. As far as being disrespected etc. - I get it - it's hard to accept, but it's fairly obvious. About not being the woman in his heart just his house, I really hope that's not entirely true. I guess I will eventually find this out from him - one way or another. I may end up getting burnt to a crisp over trying to put the pieces of our relationship back together, but isn't love about taking risks with another person?

Third, I have read Indi's sticky about the stages of a LTR and it makes a lot of sense. Thanks for the insight Indi. I think we have probably gone through most of these in some way. Unfortunately, I have no idea where in those stages we would be right now. And Indi - you are right about him being an academic and being of a different flavor. He IS different than a lot of men in some fundamental way that is hard to put a finger on. I'm not saying that because he is my partner or to excuse his behavior or for any other reason than he just is that way - different in the way he thinks or approaches life. There is more to it than that, but suffice it to say he is different (note: I am not saying "special" only different).

Just for my own gratification, I would like to share my point of view of what our relationship is (was) like. We live together and are not legally married. This was a very mutual decision for various reasons. When we first met we were friends with common interests. I was 31 and he 43. I think he had romantic interest before it ever occurred to me, but I thought he was really an interesting person, extremely intelligent and very manly (loved his long beard too). After hanging out with him for several months I realized I was in love with him and fell really hard and I have felt that way ever since. I have leaned back and let him come to me or pursue from the beginning and he did just that. We have jobs in a similar field and that has always been important to me as far as bonding with him. It makes for great conversations as do our similar political views. We do almost everything together as a couple. Please note - I said almost everything. We both have our space to do our own thing, but ultimately we enjoy each other's company (so I thought). We have common hobbies that are related to our involvement in archaeology - mostly outdoor stuff that is totally fun. These are hobbies that we both enjoyed before we met and especially after when we could do them together. We had FUN together. We have a million friends. Generally we have spent most of our free time together all these years. He is a great provider and protector - I had never considered these qualities important in prior relationships because I could take care of myself thank you very much! I was keenly aware of how blessed by the universe I was to have such a wonderful human being who loved me and at the same time was a friend and he said the same about me. I tried to never forget this on a day to day basis. I would say we were very close and in love. We rarely argued until recently when he began his emotional affair (at age 57). Much of the time I felt I was in Stage 1 of the above mentioned LTR stages. Of course over time this waxed and waned to some degree. I'll just say that I was happy and very attracted to him physically, intellectually and emotionally. I'm not saying that he was perfect and perfect I was not, but I tried to accommodate him and his idiosyncrasies and I believe he did the same for me and the relationship. He put a lot of creative thought into gifts (months before birthdays, etc.) and told me I was beautiful. Every woman wants to hear that, right? He was very attentive and loving. Great sex life throughout the years...I believed that we would always be together through thick and thin. And then surprise, surprise...there was another woman. I crashed from an extreme emotional high to being down on the ground as low as a human being could be and I am now trying to scrape myself up off the floor.

Sorry for the long tome...I just had to get some of this stuff off my chest. Like I said I am totally confused. How can one person be on such a great high and the other be so non-committal or whatever he is - especially after he presented himself to be otherwise? And how am I supposed to just kick him to the curb (so to speak) after all these happy years? I know that this is not realistic or healthy, but I just wish all of this never happened and things would return to normal. I feel like there is a knife in my back...

[Mish]

And how am I supposed to just kick him to the curb (so to speak) after all these happy years?

In the same way he kicked you to the curb after all these happy years. You weren't the one who started it, he did. Imo, if you are willing to accept this and take him back this should be done with some very explicit conditions with his complete commitment to rebuild the trust between the two of you and never repeat this again. If he can't commit to that, then I don't think any further effort will really be worth it.

[loriloo]

Absolutely the only way he will be able to remain with me is through very explicit conditions and his complete commitment to rebuild the trust between us and to never ever do this again.

By leaving for a few days and essentially cutting off contact with him, my hope is that he will come to this conclusion himself. I want him to to come to me of his own volition and I don't want to put any undue pressure on him because it is ultimately up to him to want to change his behavior an re-commit to our relationship. Otherwise, if he thinks he is doing this for me, we will both be unhappy.

Of course by leaving for a few days I am also taking the chance that he will cheat again, but that too is his decision. If so, then I know it's over for good. It's very hard for me to know that I have no control over the outcome.

[Mish]

By leaving for a few days and essentially cutting off contact with him, my hope is that he will come to this conclusion himself.

Leaving it up to him to come to a conclusion by himself could lead to a misunderstanding. I would tell the conditions you have face to face and get his verbal approval to commit to them and be bound by them before this relationship can continue. This will show that you are serious about walking away if he continues to disrespect you and that you will not tolerate if he does not live up to his commitments in the future.

[Primo]

I think everyone realizes that you're trying to make it work, that hopefully he'll come around and you can repair what was broken. I know everyone wants a positive outcome for you, whether it's how they would've handled the situation or not.

Everyone that replied is giving you another angle to look at your situation from...(theirs). The guy's on this thread are giving you a male's perspective, which I know is what you wanted. Men aren't on very different planes on a base level, though women may think so. You'd be surprised how much the philosophical Harvard grad has in common with the guy who's riveting steel on the construction site.

You know most of what happened in his relationship. He knows what he did to hurt and betray you and you're giving him the opportunity to explain why. It's only up to you if it can be worked out in the long term. Hopefully the posts on this board have made you see things from different perspectives and can be a helpful tool in figuring it out.

I hope it works out for you and wish you the best of luck.

[loriloo]

Thanks for your posts everyone...there are times when I'm hopeful things will work out and there are times when I just want to give up (like right now). Seems so bleak and hopeless. I'm hurt, then I'm mad and then I'm really pissed and then back to heartbroken...a vicious circle. Right now I feel like he's a real A.H. and does not even deserve to utter my name. I never in a million years would have guessed I would have those ugly thoughts about him. I feel that somehow I am partly to blame for all of this and I am willing to accept some responsibility, if I just knew what that was. I am back to square one - wanting him to open up to me, to talk to me about all of this...

Whatever the outcome, I will NEVER ever get so close to someone again that it might break my heart into a million pieces. I thought I had a handle on who I was as a person, but since this emotional affair has happened I found out that what I thought was my life has been destroyed. How can one human being let another have such a profound effect on them? I have tried to be my own person only to find that I let him dominate my life. From this day forward the only person I will ever depend on is me. Lesson learned.

Thanks again. If this cluster *f* turns itself around I'll give you an update.

P.S. I remember now after much thought that he mentioned the other woman to me one day right after he found her on the internet - before he contacted her (?). He said that he saw where the mother of an old friend had passed away. My reaction was one of critical indifference and a snide remark. He has an old telephone/address book wherein he has kept mostly womens phone numbers from over the past 40 years that he called his list of sluts. When he mentioned this about her I said, "Oh is she one of your sluts in your book"? And it ticked him off. Probably poor judgment on my part, but I was just using his terminology....looking back I probably should have been more sympathetic.