Transition from 'friends with benefits' to relationship, seeking advice.

[loveandfinance]

Situation:
She got out of a 4 year relationship. Wants to be single for a while to heal. She's not an easy girl and only sleeps with guys she has feelings for. She's the 'ungamable' type so to speak. I've known her years and liked her for a long time. We recently started sleeping together. Very comfortable with each other. Talk about 'what if's' for if we were in a relationship. Happy with each other, mild public display, loyal to each other.

It's almost a relationship, but she doesn't want that commitment aspect until she finds the independence she is looking for. She doesn't want to indulge so deeply in the emotional roller coaster of a relationship just yet. I've asked her out a few times because it's not a big deal for us to talk about things like that. She plays with rejecting me, but always reassures me that she likes me.

I know being patient is all I can do because she needs to heal on her own while feeding off of my strength and being there for her. We have hungout together for 7 straight days, I've gone to school with her, we chat for 8-15 hours on video on skype.. I feel like we're really into each other, but she holds back so she can find that independent stability. She was very dependent in the past and wants to grow and mature.

We have mutually established that I'm not a rebound and that I am possibly the next phase of her life.

As I just mentioned, I know my role is to play a patience game. But as a business person, I know the importance of having a success system and not relying on simply playing it by ear. Does anyone have any tips on specific behaviours I could employ to help build a strong, supportive foundation to lead into a relationship in the coming months?

Tips, advice, experiences, etc.. hugely appreciated!

Have a good one!
-Z

[Wakeup]

Does anyone have any tips on specific behaviours I could employ to help build a strong, supportive foundation to lead into a relationship in the coming months?

Yes, but you won't like it.

By just giving her what you're giving her, you're enabling her to not need to ever commit to you so, you should stop allowing her to coast the way you have been. There's nothing else you can do then to just wait and see where she takes you because you give her no reason to hurry up and label what it is you two have going. Is she seeing other men while she coasts with you?

[loveandfinance]

Is she seeing other men while she coasts with you?

No, she isn't. She hangs out with her ex sometimes because they want to give being friends a try. Sometimes she asks me if I'm okay with things like that. I know how that sounds, and they're not doing anything. He tries, but she rejects him. He knows she likes me, and the type of person she is, she would feel guilty for 'being with me' and then doing things with him. She's actually a good girl, and I know this because I've been able to watch her for 7 years.

But, what you're saying is that I should limit the things we share? To what degree? For the sake of keeping her interested, I'd still like to have behaviours with us that show I'm more than a friend. But I also see what you're saying, I don't want her to think I can be used.

However, this is also kind of a situation where I'm fighting for her, so I don't want to just let her go and see what happens. Her family supports the idea of us being together very intensely, and her friends a bit too. It's a unique situation and it's picking up very quickly. I only started talking to her 2 months ago after a year and a half of not talking, we were best friends, and we escalated our interactions to this level.

I think what I need to work on, is making her want me, not -just- backing off. What do you think? I'm new to relationships, I had 1 when I was in grade 9 for 7 months, but I don't count that as anything real world. We're both 22 now, and I want this to turn into something that works.

[Wakeup]

No, she isn't. She hangs out with her ex sometimes because they want to give being friends a try.

Oh, please don't give this girl your heart. Just do her while the doing's good but don't fall for her. She can't let go of an ex. She is still hanging with him one-on-one. Nothing and I do mean NOTHING good ever comes from being the partner of a person who is still doing date like things with someone they once were schtuuping. Its very disrespectful for her to not be including you in on this so called "friendship." But.. then again, she doesn't owe you anything because you and her are just friends with benefits.

You won't listen to me though so I'll not dwell on that. Just don't be surprised when she gets back with him because she thinks he's changed and wants to try again.

I think what I need to work on, is making her want me, not -just- backing off. What do you think?

I don't know how you work on "making" someone want you. If you believe in reverse physocology then you'll be less involved, not more.

You sound like a good guy, loveandfinance. Don't let her hurt you. Wheel in your emotions until she starts giving you more than what she currently is. At this point you're friends with benefits.

[loveandfinance]

She is still hanging with him one-on-one

Not always one-on-one, but yeah, sometimes.

Its very disrespectful for her to not be including you in on this so called "friendship."

Well, she does include me in their friendship. We used to all be friends, and kind of still are. He's learning to accept that she's moved on from him and doesn't a relationship, doesn't want to be physical or anything with him. She just wants the friendship because when they were dating he didn't behave like a friend, he behaved like a boyfriend. When their interactions are how they are now, she gets to experience the friendship everyone else does, and that's what she wants. She's 'loyal' to me in the sense that she won't do anything with other guys, but I do see what you're saying. And it does hurt and I get jealous when she hangs out with him. I've been learning to brush it off and have been able to, for the most part, not display jealousy anymore.

Just don't be surprised when she gets back with him because she thinks he's changed and wants to try again.

She doesn't want to get back with him. They did that whole on and off thing throughout the 4 years. They've been separated for 7 months. She found someone else briefly that was a fling, but when he left, she fell back to him and they were hooking up again-no relationship. Then I came along and it has helped her immensely to move on from him. What she is doing now is a step for her to try being a friend with him. However.. she mentioned she doesn't want to see him for a while, but they still hangout.

I don't know how you work on "making" someone want you.

Studying seduction and being an 'alpha male'. The things that could make me appear far more confident, slightly untouchable and so on. Slightly different behaviours to show that I'm 'above' a lot of what's going on, almost to intimidate her but in a seductive way. Things to make her feel like she needs to be on her toes trying to impress me.

Your advice is helping a lot.

[BackUpOrGetStng]

Just see other girls while you're seeing her, until she agrees to stop seeing him.

[searock]

Dude, you don't "study" seduction or being an "alpha male", whatever that even is. And spending 8-15 hours in front of a computer screen is just unhealthy and weird.

That aside, I think you should have a serious talk with this girl. Tell her that you want to be in a relationship with her, so you won't keep seeing her and doing boyfriend-girlfriend stuff with her, until she's ready to be in a relationship with you. Then follow through with it: don't go on dates with her, don't have sex with her, until she gives you a precise answer. And yes, date other girls in the meanwhile, if you want.

If she decides she wants to be in a relationship with you, she'll come back to you and you "win" (I'm not sure you can call it a win in this case, she sounds confused to say the least). If she decides NOT to be in a relationship with you, you won't have wasted even more time. So it's a win-win situation.

[loveandfinance]

I'm not in a position to be making requests that involve not seeing him. I'm lucky to be where I am with her. She needs the freedom to do whatever she wants because it will show that I'm not needy or whatever. But in that freedom, I want to do things that seduce her to being with me. I've gotten far enough to this point, the things I mentioned above. I don't want to play a game here, I like this girl and I want to seduce her into a relationship where we can go in that direction. I'm not really interested in finding another girl. If things absolutely comes to that, then obviously I will move on. But I'm not going to let girls overlap, unless it's useful to seduce her into a relationship. She doesn't see other guys, and if I was seeing other girls, she wouldn't be with me the way she is.

[searock]

Okay, then don't see other girls. Just tell her explicitly that you will NOT do anything boyfriend-girlfriend-ish with her, until she tells you that she wants to be in a relationship with you.

Then give her time to decide, with no pressure, just back off a bit and don't contact her.

If in a month's time she hasn't got back to you with a clear answer, forget about her and move on.

[Call Me Maybe]

it sounds like she's playing you and you're falling for it

[loveandfinance]

it sounds like she's playing you and you're falling for it

Uggghhhhhh... I f-ing hope not.

[loveandfinance]

I'm giving her space. I'm detaching myself emotionally. I feel nothing right now and I don't care about anything. She can do whatever the hell she wants. I'm still going to sleep with her and give her the best sex possible, make her laugh her ass off all the time. I won't be sweet. I won't be mean. I'll lay off the cuddling, hand holding, kissing. I won't call her first. I'll avoid skype once in a while. I'll be charismatic and build a lifestyle she finds attractive. And if I ever see that she develops feelings for me, I'll slowly introduce nice things once a time.. hand holding..kissing..poetry..cuddling.. gifts.. breakfasts...hand made things; origami.. fllowers... chocolates..dinners... dates....

I don't really think she's playing with me. and if she is, at least she's not playing the ex as well... as far as I know. UGH!.. I'm getting so frustrated.. but only because I care about her... I hateeeeee this brutal torment >_<

The worst part is, she is the closest person to me in my life. If something happens where her and I end.. I'll lose a connection to a human that overpowered any connection I had before.. including my own family cause they were crap.

Thanks for listening and giving me your input, people <3

[searock]

She isn't "playing" anyone, she's just completely confused as to what she wants. If you keep this up, you're just enabling her to keep treating you as she treats you now, or worse. You need to look after yourself, especially since you're so emotionally attached to her. Don't give her anything but patience and celibacy (if that's what you want), until she gives you a straight answer as to whether she wants to be in a relationship with you or not.

I know you're not going to follow this advice anyway.

[loveandfinance]

Okay, I think it has finally sunk in what I need to do, even though it's been told to me throughout this thread. I can feel in it my body, mind, and in each breath I take.



What I learned and what I'm seeing now is the need, desire, and 100% accomplished feeling of eliminated neediness. I needed to withdraw myself from letting her be the star of my life, and remember that I'M the star of my OWN life - so to speak. I needed to stay turned on by life by myself; to pick up a hobby related to my ambitions in life and lose myself in it. To find my best self, the self that she was attracted to in the first place. I need to feel that sense of complete self-satisfaction. As well to display a mild seductive game that shows I have options, to display value and a subtle sense that she doesn't have me just yet. She thinks she does and she helps to ensure, indirectly, that she's 'mine'-but also demonstrates with kindness that she has options as well, again indirectly. I have a feeling she does this to help me grow, to promote my better self again-I could be interpreting it wrong, but she knows I'm heavily into personal development so I think she's happy to give me clues along the way. (Nice to be that comfortable with someone).

Believe me, I am open to learning from and adapting to the advice mentioned in this thread that a newbie wouldn't be able to. I want the girl, and I'm willing to undergo extreme personal development and unnaturally sped up growth and maturity. I feel in my life that she is the one, (I felt like this in the past before, but there was a 1.5 year gap where we didn't talk due to drama-I was with other girls and forgot about her, so coming back and escalating so fast in just 2 months and feeling it again I'm sure says something). Also, I have learned to identify the difference between reality and fantasy.

Fantasy - I'm in love, we're great together, I don't need another girl, she's perfect.
Reality - she's attracted to the COOL me that didn't fall out of his COOL character into love and love's affection. The shift in character scared her.

Hope it's okay to document my progress with this, I'm sure there are others that might be able to learn from it.

I have one problem before I can fully indulge in the 'self-crystallization' process that reinforces that COOL, confident, independent guy that she was/is attracted to:

Last night, her, her ex, another friend and myself were going to hangout. I called her when they were taking too long because I had my own friends (a frame of my life she hasn't seen yet), and told her I would hangout with them for the night and call to meet her the next day; today.
I know this gives her space and freedom, and shows I don't care that she is hanging out with the ex. However, my tone of voice on the phone was a little bit defeated. I didn't have the best communication so I believe there is a chance it could have been interpreted that I was scared to hangout with them, because at the time I actually was. Today when I call her, I'll have a chance to start again and give a better presentation. Does anyone have thoughts on how I could approach this call? Or should I just be myself and not care how I come off this time since, this natural aura I'll reacquire again can simply take care of the micro behavioural habits by itself? I get nervous sometimes that after an event where I was needy or came off as insecure, upset, or grumpy has ruined EVERYTHING, and that EVERYTHING is over. Very "Oh no, end of the world" kind of thinking. Does anyone have tips for this feeling? Or, again, tips on how to approach the phone call? At first when I called, she was expecting I was being needy and impatient and wanted to know how long they'd be, but instead I told her I'd call her to hangout the next day. If I just had better communication in the moment, I would be fully confident that my throwing her off to be independent and give her space was a wise move to make in the process towards a relationship.

Any help, again, hugely appreciated.

Mind the length <3

L&F

[searock]

You're blatantly ignoring the advice given to you. Keep digging your own grave.