Advice giver needs advice: infidelity imminent

[Phil Davies]

I'm not talking about mudane shit like watching her chick flick or buying her flowers that she now takes for granted.

I'm talking about forgetting you are parents once a month, taking her out and seducing her like you did when you were first starting to try and get into her pants. I'm talking about taking her away for an overnighter, out to dinner and then back for a jacuzzi bath together with champagne and your favourite music playing. Just the two of you, no daughter around to tend to or life's bs to distract you. I read about far too many people that stop seducing one another once the kids come on the picture.

Well surely you knew that going in. No sense lamenting about it now but there is hope that you can rekindle. Thing is, you have to make it clear to her what you're contemplating doing. She doesn't seem to have a clue that you're so dis-satisfied. I wonder what is going through her head now that you're going out without her with single men and picking up 'connections?' Surely, like you, she's feeling underappreciated and not the least bit sexy or wanted.

Why did you stop going? Maybe sex therapy would be a tad more helpful?

Sometimes it takes two or more before you find one that is a kindred spirt.

Have you talked openly about what you're on the verge of doing?

Well, I'm going to assume that she wasn't always like this. What happened between the two of you that left her a shell of her former self?

I never said you were. ???

Did these "thrilled" divorced people allow themselves to get caught up with a younger crowd to the point that they've emotionally connected with another person that is quite happy to help break up or go to bed with a married person (your new connection does know you're married, right?) or did they just get out because they were unhappy and then they did their newly single rabble rousing?

Thats a ton to quote and it sort of jumps around a bit, let me answer in paragraph format ...

I would LOVE to take her out more, but she doesn't want to leave. She's always got a headache or moping about something. She just started seeing a therapist for depression but she's denied it for years. Obviously the beginning of our relationship was awesome, like most. I wouldn't have married her if she was like this. She was always an introvert but she was never this isolated. She had friends, we all went out, we had a blast together. When I asked her to maryr me I imagined kids with a babysitter, going to the city for dinner and a night out. Maybe one weekend we go up to the cabin with some friends, even bring the kids. But she doesn't leave the house. I made reservations two fridays ago and she bailed because she said her stomach felt funny, its always something. She swears nothing spurred this and nothing is wrong but it was a gradual change over about 4-5 years and now she's socially isolated. No one moment, just a gradual change. Hopefully the therapy helps but she refuses to acknowledge theres anything wrong. With her or our marriage.

Sex therapy? haha I suggested that and she went from blushing teenager to angry mob wife to insulted debutant. Again, she acknowledges its unusual or shes become different but she doesn't view that as a problem. So the couples therapy was pointless. We ended up talking about her mother half the time. And she said she felt uncomfortable and eventually started making excuses to not go which is why it ended.

As for the divorced crew its a bit of a mixed bag. One was cheated on so I take his "advice" with a grain of salt, he likes women about as much as Mitt Romney (I kid). Another married a high school frankenstein that he always hated, but she ended it, too. Another cheated on his wife, she caught him and left him. He was miserable for months. Then the associate types are a mixed bag too running the gamut from bored housewife strays to whatever I don't know everyones story. As the other kid pointed out I;m not the only guy on the planet who was with the same person for over a decade, got married, had a kid and is looking to stray for whatever reason. But I promise there is nothing "easy" about this way out. Aside from a massive financial loss, I'd have the priviledge of going to bed every night wondering if I turned my daughter into a man hating lesbian.

I'm not making excuses for myself and this is not an easy decision. I'm just trying to get varied perspectives.

[Phil Davies]

I'm sorry, I must have missed the part of adult orientation where they said part of growing up is becoming cynical and depressive. Quit taking yourself so seriously. Maybe your wife is unhappy because you lack a sense of humor and the ability to unclench.

You're right, humor is the answer here ... we're only dealing with light hearted, not-so-serious divorce and a decade of child psychology afterall. I'll make sure to send a Clownagram to serve her the divorce papers.

[Wakeup]

Thats a ton to quote and it sort of jumps around a bit, let me answer in paragraph format ...

I would LOVE to take her out more, but she doesn't want to leave. She's always got a headache or moping about something. She just started seeing a therapist for depression but she's denied it for years. Obviously the beginning of our relationship was awesome, like most. I wouldn't have married her if she was like this. She was always an introvert but she was never this isolated. She had friends, we all went out, we had a blast together. When I asked her to maryr me I imagined kids with a babysitter, going to the city for dinner and a night out. Maybe one weekend we go up to the cabin with some friends, even bring the kids. But she doesn't leave the house. I made reservations two fridays ago and she bailed because she said her stomach felt funny, its always something. She swears nothing spurred this and nothing is wrong but it was a gradual change over about 4-5 years and now she's socially isolated. No one moment, just a gradual change. Hopefully the therapy helps but she refuses to acknowledge theres anything wrong. With her or our marriage.

Sex therapy? haha I suggested that and she went from blushing teenager to angry mob wife to insulted debutant. Again, she acknowledges its unusual or shes become different but she doesn't view that as a problem. So the couples therapy was pointless. We ended up talking about her mother half the time. And she said she felt uncomfortable and eventually started making excuses to not go which is why it ended.

As for the divorced crew its a bit of a mixed bag. One was cheated on so I take his "advice" with a grain of salt, he likes women about as much as Mitt Romney (I kid). Another married a high school frankenstein that he always hated, but she ended it, too. Another cheated on his wife, she caught him and left him. He was miserable for months. Then the associate types are a mixed bag too running the gamut from bored housewife strays to whatever I don't know everyones story. As the other kid pointed out I;m not the only guy on the planet who was with the same person for over a decade, got married, had a kid and is looking to stray for whatever reason. But I promise there is nothing "easy" about this way out. Aside from a massive financial loss, I'd have the priviledge of going to bed every night wondering if I turned my daughter into a man hating lesbian.

I'm not making excuses for myself and this is not an easy decision. I'm just trying to get varied perspectives.

Does your daughter suspect that you and her mother are codependent and not actually in love? Do you argue often or is your relationship an apathetic mess?

You keep saying she's an apathetic mess but does she actually understand that you are currently seeking the attentions of other women in order to keep your ego on straight? I believe in marriage and we do things to keep ours together but you're painting your wife as not giving a flying eff whether or not you're together or not. You don't seem to care either actually but I think you'd stay in this codependent mess if you didn't have some chippy/doesn't care that you're married and will do you anyway in the wings making it seem more safe to you.

You should stop seeing the chippy. You should seek out a kindred spirit in a therapist of your own who will understand you. You should wait and see how your wife's therapy helps with her depression. I think if that gets fixed so will her stick-in-the-mudness. You are her husband and I think you owe it to both yourselves to fix your own and her own underlying emotional/psychological problems before you divorce. It's stupid to stay if nothing is getting better but it's even stupider for you to leave because some piece on the side has made you think you're alive again.

[sadie_genie]

Your wife is her own person. Her life purpose isn't there to fulfill your desires. If you see people as a means to fulfill your happiness, you will never be happy because people are not puppets. Have some compassion for your wife and appreciate the fact that she has chosen to be your life long companion rather complaining about how she isn't acting the way you want her to act, or how she doesn't fit in your imaginary fantasies of how your love life should be.

[Phil Davies]

Does your daughter suspect that you and her mother are codependent and not actually in love? Do you argue often or is your relationship an apathetic mess?

You keep saying she's an apathetic mess but does she actually understand that you are currently seeking the attentions of other women in order to keep your ego on straight? I believe in marriage and we do things to keep ours together but you're painting your wife as not giving a flying eff whether or not you're together or not. You don't seem to care either actually but I think you'd stay in this codependent mess if you didn't have some chippy/doesn't care that you're married and will do you anyway in the wings making it seem more safe to you.

You should stop seeing the chippy. You should seek out a kindred spirit in a therapist of your own who will understand you. You should wait and see how your wife's therapy helps with her depression. I think if that gets fixed so will her stick-in-the-mudness. You are her husband and I think you owe it to both yourselves to fix your own and her own underlying emotional/psychological problems before you divorce. It's stupid to stay if nothing is getting better but it's even stupider for you to leave because some piece on the side has made you think you're alive again.

Seems like reasonable advice, actually. I think if I had someone to talk to about this maybe it wouldn't fester and grow into something it may not be. But like I said its tough to find someone your comfortable enough to talk to about this sort of thing. Usually its family or friends and I can't ask them ... I would never put someone in that awkward of a spot, either. Again, Im going to find another therapist to see if I can get anywhere before I do anything rash.

My daughter is too young, she doesn't and wouldn't understand any of this (yet). For right now I'm sure she thinks nothing is wrong, she really doesn't seem to pick up on our tension and as mentioned we never really fight. I've told her (my wife obviously) that if something doesn't change I may cheat. She almost doesn't believe me, she knows I've been faithful for so long and she's heard about my deflection tactics with would be homewreckers. Her friends and family all love me and think I'm a good guy so she has no reason to believe I would actually cheat. I would have to do it, then tell her everything that happened and how I feel about it, almost prove to her that I cheated. But then my marriage would definitely be over.

To answer your question I believe she cares. She just doesn't show it. She doesn't show any emotion, really. I care, too.

EDIT: Is the "chippy" the would be mistress? I haven't seen her since and don't plan on it. I wish I could say its because I don't want to but geography and complexities of life make it unlikely we'll see each other for a while.

[Phil Davies]

Your wife is her own person. Her life purpose isn't there to fulfill your desires. If you see people as a means to fulfill your happiness, you will never be happy because people are not puppets. Have some compassion for your wife and appreciate the fact that she has chosen to be your life long companion rather complaining about how she isn't acting the way you want her to act, or how she doesn't fit in your imaginary fantasies of how your love life should be.

I wonder how she'd feel if I quit my job, sat on the couch in my underwear all day scratching my nuts and watching Seinfeld reruns. Then pissed the bed twice a week and and slept in the closet.

Should she just shut up and be happy that I chose to be her "lifelong companion"?

[ttylox]

I'll make sure to send a Clownagram to serve her the divorce papers.

Heehee. Maybe you're not dead on the inside after all.

[haxan]

There's not much to discuss really. You've done everything possible, from what you've stated, to make your marriage happy and keep the romance alive. It's not working and your wife is growing more uninterested with each passing day.

Yes divorce is an unpleasant event, but there's also a reason that it exists. Sometimes things just don't click anymore, be it 1 year in, 10, 15 or 30. Cheating is ridiculous. You've exhausted all opportunities to make things work with her, if you have to divorce, divorce. There's a child involved, which is a shame, but in actuality maybe your wife will be happier when she's an ex and you're just writing the check every month (who knows, right?). I think children became more disillusioned with divorce because a bitter parent(s) won't let go of the hurt. Hopefully she'll make things easy in that regard.

Don't cheat, make your decision about what's best for everyone and move forward.

[iamaninnocentma]

There's not much to discuss really. You've done everything possible, from what you've stated, to make your marriage happy and keep the romance alive. It's not working and your wife is growing more uninterested with each passing day.

Yes divorce is an unpleasant event, but there's also a reason that it exists. Sometimes things just don't click anymore, be it 1 year in, 10, 15 or 30. Cheating is ridiculous. You've exhausted all opportunities to make things work with her, if you have to divorce, divorce. There's a child involved, which is a shame, but in actuality maybe your wife will be happier when she's an ex and you're just writing the check every month (who knows, right?). I think children became more disillusioned with divorce because a bitter parent(s) won't let go of the hurt. Hopefully she'll make things easy in that regard.

Don't cheat, make your decision about what's best for everyone and move forward.

I dont often agree with haxans posts, and this shite doesnt look like changing my stance.

[Wakeup]

You've done everything possible, from what you've stated, to make your marriage happy and keep the romance alive.

Hardly "everything" surely!

You've exhausted all opportunities to make things work with her,

He's attempted things while she has been in a state of depression. She's getting help for that now so maybe he should just put everything on hold until he sees how her therapy can help her ~ or not.

I have a feeling that if "chippy" wasn't in the picture ~ He'd be viewing his lot a lot less negatively.

EDIT: Is the "chippy" the would be mistress?

Yes! ... and, you never did answer if she knows that you are married??? Have you been honest with her?

I haven't seen her since and don't plan on it. I wish I could say its because I don't want to but geography and complexities of life make it unlikely we'll see each other for a while.

Now distance yourself emotionally or you might as well just forget reconnecting with your wife.

Figure out what to do after you've waited and you see how your own therapy and that of your wife's pans out. Afterall; depressed people don't have much motivation.

[VincenzoG91]

If you came here for support to leave your wife, then you got it - but you can't hate on those of us who don't agree. I'm one of those psychos that thinks marriage is a lifetime decision and when you go into it, you go into it knowing that one day sh!t might get boring, she might get fat or he might lose his job... but this is the one you chose. If you're not the type of person who can make a commitment like that, then don't do it - and certainly don't breed and bring more lives into the situation to ruin.

That's crap advice. He should stay in a dead marriage just because you think marriage should be eternal. That's stupid. He isn't happy. His wife isn't happy. Their attempt at counseling has failed. There is no logical reason for their marriage to continue. Don't claim it's for the sake of their kid, because you don't have any proof that the kid will be better off if they stay unhappily married.

[Wakeup]

That's crap advice. He should stay in a dead marriage just because you think marriage should be eternal. That's stupid. He isn't happy. His wife isn't happy. Their attempt at counseling has failed. There is no logical reason for their marriage to continue. Don't claim it's for the sake of their kid, because you don't have any proof that the kid will be better off if they stay unhappily married.

Well, I certainly don't agree with staying in a dead marriage for the sake of one's child or when the only glue that keeps them together is their codependent hell however: He's been trying to do things with a wife who is depressed and who wasn't getting any treatment for her depression. Shit.. most women would be depressed if their guy was hanging with younger, single homeys and picking up "chippies" because their ego is giving them shit.

For the sake of EVERYONE involved the least he could do is approach this when she's not in the dark pits. In sickness and in health for goodness sakes.

[ttylox]

For the sake of EVERYONE involved the least he could do is approach this when she's not in the dark pits. In sickness and in health for goodness sakes.

Just thought that deserved repeating.

[iamaninnocentma]

Is it just me, or is this thee best thread title ever. Advice giver, lol. What a cunt.

[Phil Davies]

Hardly "everything" surely!

He's attempted things while she has been in a state of depression. She's getting help for that now so maybe he should just put everything on hold until he sees how her therapy can help her ~ or not.

I have a feeling that if "chippy" wasn't in the picture ~ He'd be viewing his lot a lot less negatively.

Yes! ... and, you never did answer if she knows that you are married??? Have you been honest with her?

Now distance yourself emotionally or you might as well just forget reconnecting with your wife.

Figure out what to do after you've waited and you see how your own therapy and that of your wife's pans out. Afterall; depressed people don't have much motivation.

1. This whole depression thing just surfaced, she flat out denies she's depressed. Its not like she's suicidal or anything she's always been passive its just that the antisocial thing has really ramped up. She is convinced nothing is wrong at all. You make it sound like I'm out banging hookers while she's laying in a bathtub with her wrists cut. And as mentioned, I'm waiting it out to see if therapy has any effect. I know it didn't the first time when we went together so I'm not hopeful. I doubt she'll go beyond a few sessions.

2. Having emotional feelings towards another person can't be shut off like a switch, thats a very childish thing to say. This isn't my first time around the block I know how to deal with this, out of sight out of mind and in due time its business as usually without "chippy" in the picture. To be clear, if I was to get divorced I wouldn't jump into another relationship anyway.

3. "Chippy" knows I'm married. She has a boyfriend (only a couple of months). This wasn't a drunken night at Club Hot Tits where we did shots and made bad decisions this was a rather lengthy and drawn out "just sort of happened" emotional connection that neither of us expected over the course of about 12 hours. Doesn't necessarily make it any better just sayin'.