Advice please - am I wrong?

[Murray]

Hi, 1st time on here, don’t know who to talk to so trying this. I’m an objective person, my nature is absolutely focused on balance (which has alienated those close to me on many times as I don’t simply support their views/wishes without question) but I’m in a problem area in my relationship that I can’t seem to fix.

I live with my partner, Wendy, 48 and her daughter, Jane 21. We both left our marriages to set up home together 12 yrs ago. I work away in the oil business, 4 weeks away, 4 at home. She has two other lads 22 & 25 who live in a house I’ve brought for them to rent as they can’t afford to get together the downpayment for a mortgage.

My own daughter has a 3yr old son and is married. She owns has a house that she rents, and she lives in a house I brought for her and rents it from me at a reduced rate so she can have more money each month.

I has some money sitting in the bank and rather than gaining no interest thought it would be better to but two houses on MG’s and rent them back to the children at reduced rent to help them. In Wendy’s case, her two struggle for work, have no qualifications etc so if I hadn’t have done this they would be living in bedsits with no prospects of having a decent home. They were living in their Fathers house, but when he got married he sold the house from under them with no consideration of where they would live.

Wendy doesn’t want them living with us (Can’t say I would either) so I tried to help them.

My intent and what I’ve told both my own and her’s is that they can but the houses off me in 6-7 yrs time at what I paid for them as this is when I plan to retire and therefore need the deposits (some 100k) from them for retirement fund. If they have equity in the houses and decide to sell them straight away they can keep the profit as a bonus.

The rent they both pay is what the MG’s are to me which is far less than current rental rates. They both get a good and fair deal all round in my opinion.

Without trying to be arrogant - that sounds pretty darn fair to me.

We’ve just come back from a family holiday in FLA. It was Jane’s 21st and so we took her to FLA (we live in England) to celebrate it. We took her friend and her friends son and I paid for them as well as they are living on welfare benefits as she is a single Mum. Wendy also suggested that we take my daughter and her family as we had been estranged for 3-4 years and have only just got back to being a ‘family’ again. I paid for them too.

I was sceptical at 1st because of the problems associated with step parenting over the years but agreed.

It was also Wendy’s suggestion that we buy the house from her ex and let me daughter rent it to help her as I was buying a house for her two lads.

So – we’ve come back from FLA, there were some fraught times (as expected) and we’d been home a couple of days. I was flying back to work the next day and on the evening before I was flying out, one of Wendy’s back teeth (a crown that had come loose on holiday and I’d put back in temporarily) came out during dinner and she swallowed it. After trying to cough it up I persuaded her to go to A&E and see what they could do. I asked her if she wanted me to take her but she said no she would go with her daughter so I could relax before I left early the next day. She went and they said it would pass through her system and she would have to check her No 2’s over the next week to find it. This she did and it’s got sorted out without problem.

During the evening she was in A&E, my daughter called to say have a safe trip etc and I told her that Wendy had gone to A&E because of her tooth. She asked if she was ok, but nothing more was said.

Wendy came back, I got up early next morning and left for 4 weeks. After 2 weeks my daughter went to have her hair cut by Wendy’s daughter (it’s her job) and she asked how her Mum was about the tooth. Jane told Wendy that Kate (my daughter) had asked and Wendy went mental because I’d told her.

I asked her what was wrong with telling her and she said because her and her mother would be having a great time at her expense because she would have to check her No.2’s to find the tooth etc etc and it was the worst thing I could have done.

I’ve said I can’t comprehend what she is saying, going on to ask her if she has asked her 2 x friends if what I did was wrong and she said that they both think I’m an ahole for telling her.

I said I find this incredulous and frankly don’t truly believe her, or of they did they are telling her what she wants to hear as she has a history of cutting people off dead when they cross her.

She now wants to completely exorcise Kate from her life and of course I’ve gotten into a counter by saying to hell with it then I’ll treat her daughter that same way.

I must add that recently she’d told me that in her opinion Jane’s 21st bday in FLA, all expenses paid + her friend and her son too was nothing special as Kate and her family had gone as well and so it was not giving her daughter anything other than what my daughter had gotten.

I thought that was rather ungrateful but being a balanced guy want some feedback for you out there because I think she’s being a total – well you know what.

Am I so very wrong on both these issues? Am I so disconnected from what people think? I’m 54 in October and never in my life have I felt so disconnected with another human being. I’m not perfect and can be overbearing and certainly over analytical, but in my mind this it totally unfair and bordering on downright bloody nasty.

Help needed please.

Tks, Murray

[MerryH]

She now wants to completely exorcise Kate from her life and of course I’ve gotten into a counter by saying to hell with it then I’ll treat her daughter that same way.

You're both wrong in this and you're both being childish. Does your wife have a history with Kate? Are they known to fight/bicker/gossip about each other? If so, then you should have known better than to give Kate ammunition. If not, then telling her about your wife's "No 2's" was pretty tacky and not your place, but shouldn't have caused a huge issue.

I must add that recently she’d told me that in her opinion Jane’s 21st bday in FLA, all expenses paid + her friend and her son too was nothing special as Kate and her family had gone as well and so it was not giving her daughter anything other than what my daughter had gotten.

So, what, she thinks you owe her another birthday present? Why was this even brought up? Yes, you were very generous and all parties involved should have been immensely grateful and nothing else.

[KelE]

Wow. I think you should both make up and get over it. Agree to not tell personal private things to others, because people should be able to decide what is private for them. That is an intimacy issue and you don't want to mess with that. Trust is very important, even though this seems trivial to you. If it isn't to your wife then that is her right. On the other issues, I think you are very generous and she shouldn't have any complaints about generous things you do, because you are not required to do them. At the same time just because you do those things it is not open season to do things that upset her. Once again I think you should both calm down though. Figure out if there is more to it, Get it resolved and move on.

[Murray]

Hi to you both, and tks for feeding back.

I didn't tell Kate about No.2's, it was only when Wendy came back & said that's what's needed, I didn't speak to Kate about it again and haven't done. Wendy is freaked out becuase she perceives Kate and her Mother are laughing about her behind her back.

Yes, they have a dreadful history, truly dreadful. There's deep resentment on both sides for all manner of reasons. My problem is how to deal with this. Kate is clearly not wlecome at my house. If I go visit or spend time with her and her son, I get sh*t for days afterward from Wendy in the sulking mode. If I therefore capitulate and don't see Kate, I feel bad and miss her and her lad.

Wendy's daughter is a spoilt, ungrateful little so and so who only ever contacts me when I'm being a cashpoint. No hugs, no affection, nothing yet crawls up her mother's backside for handout's, treats her like dirt but that's acceptable.

Yet if I treat her like my daughter is treated I get ostricised for days at a time till I cave in and apologise to them both.

I can't see anyway to move forward other than break up or exclude my daughter from my life again which I'm not prepared to do again. Kate is a cow to Wendy, but even when Kate tries she's trashed after a short time, as Kate can do no right when compared to her own daughter - classic biased step parenting.

It makes me hugely resent Wendy for being so one sided and I can't see a way out other than break up.

But - can anybody really see that what I told kate was so wrong, and would her two 'friends' really agree with her or are they simply telling her what she wants to hear? I'm asking independants here - not asking for support.

thanks again.

[MerryH]

But - can anybody really see that what I told kate was so wrong, and would her two 'friends' really agree with her or are they simply telling her what she wants to hear? I'm asking independants here - not asking for support.

In a normal, healthy family, informing one family member that another had gone to the emergency room would have been completely acceptable and expected. Of course. You didn't do anything wrong, exactly, but since your family seems extremely dysfunctional and those two have a history of being bitches to each other, it was a mistake on your part to say anything. So yeah, her friends might have agreed with her. But it really seems like you can't do anything right in her eyes, anyway, so trying to be right is futile.

[Murray]

Hi Merry, tks for taking the time. I'm genuinely not a bleeding heart looking for moral support to prove to her she's wrong. I just think this is just another stepping stone toward breakup
as if I crapped money it still is'nt good enough.

It is totally dysfucntional - I have never had to watch my words or pick them carefully before (other than normal everyday work or social graces) becuase I've never been in this type of totally one sided relationship before. I'm away at the moment in Oman, my choice, pays well and gives me equal time off to spend with the family - but what family? My own daughter causes me grief becuase of her resentments of the past (believe me she has some which are well founded ie when she was living with us, Wendy emptying the freezer and taking it to her Mothers so Kate did'nt have anything to eat when we she came away to visit me when I was office working abroad, her own duaghter was staying at her parents of course, Kate would be left in the house at 18) and Wendy wants everything for her own duaghter regardless of the balance or fairness of it all 'Jane didn't have a special 21st becuase Kate and her family came too - Kate got as much of a treat as Jane did' - how can you possibly arrive at that conclusion?

So, I finish my tour of work next Wednesday and go home to what - caught up between these two, fearing doing something for my own daughter becuase I'll be shut out in my own home whilst she surrounds herself with her kids and ignores me totally? I've often asked myself why Jane doesn't turn round to her Mother when she behaves like this and says 'why are you being so unfair to Murray Mother? - I would and have in certain times in my life. Am I just gutless and naive?

I don't want to go home, I'm not looking forward to it, and after being in the desert for 5 weeks that can't be right can it.

But I'm 54, everything is shared ownership, I've worked my tail off for the last 10 yrs away from home to put us in a really great position for retirement, earluy if possible, but if I walk I lose 50% of it all and will have to work forever just to re-start.

And believe me - by her own admission she will cut her nose off to spite her face to almost psychotic extremes and has done so in the past.

Am I just a trapped, gutless fool, scared of getting rid becuase of the time of life circumstances?

[MerryH]

But I'm 54, everything is shared ownership, I've worked my tail off for the last 10 yrs away from home to put us in a really great position for retirement, earluy if possible, but if I walk I lose 50% of it all and will have to work forever just to re-start.

Well, that really sucks. Are you sure this is the only result of a separation? Keep looking into it. There's got to be a better potential outcome.

And if not, is it really worth it to spend your last remaining years on earth with Wendy the Nightmare? Break it off, apologize to your own kids for introducing Wendy into their lives, repair those relationships, and be a good father and grandfather from now on.

[Murray]

Hi Merry, tks for the post. My trouble is I'm simply the type that believes, truly believes that people can change and that ultimately
we're all fair minded. When it is good it's very good, but when it's bad it's so depressingly awful yet she seems to sail through without a care in the
world wrapping herself up with her children and me being totally shut out in my own home.

I've often called her a bully to her face. I despise bullies, but I fear that this one is playing at her 'power' and she is only in it for the rewards + I go away for a month
every other month - how hard can it be?

I left her once some 5 yrs ago. I met my 1st girlfriend (Sue) from schooldays after my Mother passed, and we clicked, really clicked and fell in love all over again - but I became gutless and resentful of Wendy living in 'my' house with another guy and finished it with the 'old girlfriend' when her and the new bloke (my read is she pushed him too quick for financial support, he'd gotten what he wanted in the bedroom and scarpered - I read the emails to confirm her begging him to go back when he dumped her) broke up, we got back and it's been a nightmare ever since.

Why can't I have the confidence (guts) to just go without the safety blanket of another like before? I feel very ashamed of how I treated Sue - I broke her heart - all becuase of my pathetic insecurities and dare I say 'wanting it all' back.

If she despises my daughter so much and the way I want to be with her, why does'nt she leave? She says we're not compatible whatsoever, there's too many children problems and she hates my proffession (I'm in the oil biz) so why stay?

I feel like a complete loser writing this. Not a loser in the material sence, a loser in that I haven't got the guts or self esteem to tell her to stick her attitude and walk. If my Father was still here, boy, he'd kick my backside.

[devonbrown]

Just a couple of quick thoughts:

A) Wendy is upset because she feels you broke a trust. It is not rational, it is an emotional response to a "perceived" slight. You just have to deal with that. Apologize to her (even if you didn't do anything objectively wrong) and tell her that you will try to be more sensitive to her feelings in the future.

B) You talk about being objective and focused on balance, etc. I understand the theory behind that. But it doesn't always work out when emotions are involved. So, with all good intentions, I say this: STOP KEEPING SCORE! Stop counting the money that is spent. Stop making tallies of what you do and what others do. It means absolutely nothing in the long run. If you keep thinking that way, you will be in total balance and alone.

C) She is your daughter, so tell Wendy that you will have a relationship with her if you want. But don't threaten to cut off her kids in retaliation. That is just tacky.

D) You are in this relationship because you both left your previous marriages. I don't know the backstory, and I know you said it was 12 years ago, but if you were cheating on your previous wife with Wendy, there are probably still lingering issues of Wendy wondering if she is completely enough for you. Or wondering if you will just trade her in for someone else if things get too difficult. Or maybe she is trying to do that to you.

Bottom line, talk to her. Be mature (but that doesn't mean being unemotional).

Good luck.

[Murray]

Devon, tks man, I appreciate the time you've taken.

You're right of course the tooth thing is irrational. I have apologised, and can quite easily make sure I don't make the same mistake again, but to be candid I don't know if
I want to be that particular in my life any longer. If it had been anybody else other than Kate it would'nt have mattered a jot, but as it was her it is another opportunity to give me crap about my daughter.

I'm constantly walking on eggshells around her re Kate and I'm tired of it now. I take your advice about simply telling her I'm going to enjoy a relationship with Kate again. I've been scared, yes scared of her bullying ways in the past and I'm ashamed to admit that but it's true.

I take your point about the balance thing. I know it's a fault of mine, but I just expect decent people to do the same thing and appreciate the things I do. I appreciate the things that people do for me and tell them so, every other person in my life conducts themselves like this, it's called good manners and niceness - this lot don't have that and I've known it for some time. The people who don't conduct themselves with good manners are not people I want to be associated with, and I've avoided these types of people in the past. I guess that tells me something pretty clear.

Maybe she is thinking about trading me in, it's crossed my mind why she stays if all she wants to do is give me and Kate shit, but perhaps (& not being arrogant here, just objective) the lifestyle she has and me only being there for 4 weeks at a time is bearable..

I'd like to fix it, who does'nt want to be in a nice relationship, but I'm tired of living in 'fear' of being sulked with or shut out at a whim all the time and not altogetheer certain if I really like her anymore.

Tks again bud,
Murray