I cant understand her, plz help

[The Crimson Kin]

Hello,

I have started seeing or "catching up" with a girl for a few times, then things have suddenly changed for the worse. I did a lot of stupid things and big mistakes, but i believe she did some as well..... we are both 24 years old.

Basically met a girl at uni a few months ago, we chatted for 30 minutes and we really got along well. She had to go because she had a test, i was kicking my self because i didnt have the guts to get her number

A few days later, i saw again at the exact same table, chatted for another 30 minutes, got her number and sort of asked her out...

Went on three "dates" , well i thought they were dates.... she refereed to them as "meet ups" or "catch ups"... what ever..... i also paid for all expenses on the 3 "dates"

Date 1: University Tavern, together for 3 hours, every thing went good. I didnt hug or kiss her, but i got the feeling that i was meant to when i saw her first, like she was going for a hug and kiss..... i ask her if she is single, she says she isnt looking for a boyfriend.... also she would keep brining up her ex once in a while... they broke up on good terms as he had to go back to the USA, he asked her to come but she couldnt. That was about 4-6 months ago...

Date 2: She texts me and asks to go to dinner and a few drinks with her at a Bar later, so yeah she initiates this date, she drops me off home because i took a taxi there, When i first meet her i hug and kiss her on the cheeck, and when she drops me off home she hugs and kisses me on the cheeck in the car, i notice when we are hugging i was the first to let go, and she was still hugging me which is a good sign i think. Also we joke and discuss about going to a beer making valley next week, and she agrees and says she cant wait.

Few days later i ask her if she can give me as much heads up about the valley as i got a few exams on the week end, a few days later she sends me a msg saying that she cant make it to the valley because she is a fitness freak and health freak and trying to get more fit. I call her 30 minutes and ask her if we can go to a fancy expensive restaurant. I figured because she dropped out of uni and started a new job lets celebrate in style. she agree.

Date 3: She picks me up, we go to the restaraunt, every thing is going really good, we talk forever, she is like serving me food and sharing food together, we then go to the movies. At the movies she is like talking to me through out the whole movie on whats going to happen etc, so yeah things are looking good. On the way back home she says she "trusts me" and feels like she can talk to me about anything - im a bit worried as im thinking maybe im going into the friend zone
She drops me off home and we hug and kiss on the cheeks, i think ok im going to kiss her on the lips, and i ask if i can hug and kiss her again, i do, but then i start like brushing her hair and touching her neck, and feel like i should kiss her, but chicken out. I dont think this was too much of a big deal as she was still smiling, and when she got home she txted me she enjoyed the night and cant wait for our next meet up

So, when she leaves i kind of panicked and thought i maybe freaked her out by not kissing her and stuff, so i called her like 6 times like a dumb idiot, she couldnt answer because she was driving. She gets home and calls me and i make up shit like i wanted to know if she was ok.


Anyway, we text back and forth for a while. Cant catch up that week as it was the easter week end and she was going out of town with "old high school friends". Easter Friday she texts me asking how i am going, and we text a lot. Easter Sunday i txt her happy easter and she responds back. So things are going real good now im thinking.

Then i call her wednesday at 7:00 PM, no response, so im like ok i wont be a wierdo i will leave it at that.
Text her thursday saying "hey sorry i missed you last night, can i call you tonight at around 7 ish so we can sort out week end plans?" She doesn't respond to that text. I call 7, no response. Im like ok wat ever. Then 1 hour later she sends me a text saying "hey sorry i missed your call, im at the cinemas. Can we talk tomorrow ?". I dont respond to that text

Then Friday, i call her lunch time (her lunch break) no response, i leave a voice message asking her out on a date, and telling her we should go to another fancy restaurant, then catch a movie. I send a text as well with the same msg, telling her the details and sorry for sending a text as well but i am sending it because maybe she cant check voice mail or has no credit. Anyway, she doesnt turn up to the date or even call me. This is the first time i use the word "date" when asking her out...

So nearly 8 days pass, and she sends me text last saturday saying:
"Hey (ny name), sorry ive been missing in action lately, i really enjoy chatting to you but have been busy with work.... hope to catch up soon"
"

I thought it was a lame excuse and wasnt happy that she was ignoring me before and took so long to get back to me, and i reckon she was lying.

So i got a bit angry and sent this txt 8 hours after she sent me that text. I sent her this:
"In 8 days you couldn't find 1 minute 2 text me back? Why do you never return my calls? Why do did you leave me hanging friday and not at least get back to me that you couldn't make it? I deserve more respect then this, and it seems like you dont respect me"

3 hours later she sends this to me:
"Im really sorry about that i just wasn't ready for anythin more than frienship n it seemed like it was heading that way with the fancy dinners... that friday i was pumped but the royal wedding n forgot thyat i handnt msged you and got busy with work after... i respect you a lot and hope that u know thats true"

I responded with this:

"Thats cool (girls name). I appreciate ur honesty.. i still respect you and want you to understand that i do do not have any bad feelings towards you. I honestly thought you wanted a 2 be more then friends when you told me you wanted to cook for me, that you wanted to go travelling with me and that your goal was 2 have a partner and companion. Are you trying to 2 tell me that you only want 2 be friends, or are you trying to take things slow with me? Either way i wont be offended, just want to know if we are on the same page."

I then feel really bad about the aggressive message i sent her and send this txt 15 minutes later (yeah i know stupid move):

"Sorry last text 4 2nite im sorry sending you that harsh txt (girls name). I had no right 2 talk 2 you like that"

She then sends me this txt:

"Thanks 4 that (my name), i really appreciate that. I enjoy your company and im sorry if i led you to think i want a relationship so quickly. Lets hangout as friends 4 now and see how things go"

I just sent her this txt msg:
"Thank you (girls name), first understand you did nothing wrong, and im sorry i made this awkward 4 u. Lets start fresh, just hang out and have fun. Give me a buzz wen u want 2 catch up. Enjoy your day (girls name)."

anyway her response was this:
"Great idea (my name) thanks 4 being so understanding"

[The Crimson Kin]

Im thinking positively, and perhaps clutching at straws, and that perhaps she needs some space from me and needs more time to get to know me and decide who i am and what i am really about. Some of my female friends have told me that girls get suspicious about nice guys and their motives....

So anyway, i give her space for a week.

Send her the following txts yesterday:
Saturday 10:30 AM
Me: Hey, the strangest thing just happened, i saw a cat that looks just like you! Text me back so i know a evil wizard hasnt turned you into a cat Hope things are ok with you (girls name)....

Saturday 10:55 AM
Her: Hey (my name) haha thats great, did the cat have chinky eyes

Saturday 11:10 AM
Me: Chinky eyes? hahahaha omg nah but it said lah alot and had a tat i think I spotted it outside (nightclub name), the little party animal

And thats that, no response from her since. I mean perhaps you cant really respond or comment any further on the last txt i sent, but yeah wondering why she didnt respond. Again i am over analyzing things again...

[The Crimson Kin]

And finally i just want to say i know a messed up big time by not kissing her on the third date, calling her like 6 times after that was a HUGE mistake, and most importantly the biggest mistake was my "angry txt" - i shouldnt have shown her that i was hurt or had feelings for her after only 3 "dates" and also i know i kind of came ot sounding needy and clingy.... something that i am totally not.

I wish i can prove this to the girl but i reckon its maybe it....

I know i had to slow down and stop putting pressure on this girl when we hang out and just go with the flow...

My question is, is there still hope, and if there is, what now??? Wold waiting another week and asking for a casual meet up in the city to hang out be too soon for me?

[MynameisJesus]

i also paid for all expenses on the 3 "dates"

--> Why? Falls into the category of " I'll do anything to make you fall for me " and it really doesn't work

Date 1: University Tavern, together for 3 hours, every thing went good. I didnt hug or kiss her, but i got the feeling that i was meant to when i saw her first, like she was going for a hug and kiss.....

Don't count on that. You can't see things clearly if you like her so much

i ask her if she is single, she says she isnt looking for a boyfriend....

Exhibit A that you are totally wrong

also she would keep brining up her ex once in a while

Exhibit B, this should really ring a bell to you but you ignore it because you like her

Date 2: She texts me and asks to go to dinner and a few drinks with her at a Bar later, so yeah she initiates this date, she drops me off home because i took a taxi there, When i first meet her i hug and kiss her on the cheeck, and when she drops me off home she hugs and kisses me on the cheeck in the car, i notice when we are hugging i was the first to let go, and she was still hugging me which is a good sign i think. Also we joke and discuss about going to a beer making valley next week, and she agrees and says she cant wait

Still a friends thing. Believe me

Few days later i ask her if she can give me as much heads up about the valley as i got a few exams on the week end, a few days later she sends me a msg saying that she cant make it to the valley because she is a fitness freak and health freak and trying to get more fit.

Women always come up with excuses when they don't want to do something. " I still have to feed my lama, he has some mental illness "
It also seems to me that you are always the one who is chasing. She enjoys that attention, but she is not attracted to you. Try to find out if she texts you when you don't text her

And just so you'll remember next time, I will translate the most common sentence from the female dictionary for you.

" I am really confused now. I need time to think "
That means " I am not in love with you. But I don't want to tell you yet"

Remember that. You're gonna hear that line at least 10 more times if you stick to this attitude

Date 3: She picks me up, we go to the restaraunt, every thing is going really good, we talk forever. On the way back home she says she "trusts me" and feels like she can talk to me about anything - im a bit worried as im thinking maybe im going into the friend zone

You put yourself in this position by being sweet, paying for her expenses, letting her talk about her issues. That puts you on the same height as her girl friends. You have put yourself in the friend zone because you would make any effort for her. Her doormat. Stop giving in to your intuition that says you have to do anything for her to make her want you. The opposite is true

She drops me off home and we hug and kiss on the cheeks, i think ok im going to kiss her on the lips, and i ask if i can hug and kiss her again, i do, but then i start like brushing her hair and touching her neck, and feel like i should kiss her, but chicken out. I dont think this was too much of a big deal as she was still smiling, and when she got home she txted me she enjoyed the night and cant wait for our next meet up

So, when she leaves i kind of panicked and thought i maybe freaked her out by not kissing her and stuff, so i called her like 6 times like a dumb idiot, she couldnt answer because she was driving. She gets home and calls me and i make up shit like i wanted to know if she was ok.

This is where it really escalated, and she feels what your intentions really are. Calling her 6 times falls into the category of needy and " I'll do anything for you" again

Anyway, we text back and forth for a while. Cant catch up that week as it was the easter week end and she was going out of town with "old high school friends". Easter Friday she texts me asking how i am going, and we text a lot. Easter Sunday i txt her happy easter and she responds back. So things are going real good now im thinking.

Then i call her wednesday at 7:00 PM, no response, so im like ok i wont be a wierdo i will leave it at that.
Text her thursday saying "hey sorry i missed you last night, can i call you tonight at around 7 ish so we can sort out week end plans?" She doesn't respond to that text. I call 7, no response. Im like ok wat ever. Then 1 hour later she sends me a text saying "hey sorry i missed your call, im at the cinemas. Can we talk tomorrow ?". I dont respond to that text

Then Friday, i call her lunch time (her lunch break) no response, i leave a voice message asking her out on a date, and telling her we should go to another fancy restaurant, then catch a movie. I send a text as well with the same msg, telling her the details and sorry for sending a text as well but i am sending it because maybe she cant check voice mail or has no credit. Anyway, she doesnt turn up to the date or even call me. This is the first time i use the word "date" when asking her out...

So nearly 8 days pass, and she sends me text last saturday saying:
"Hey (ny name), sorry ive been missing in action lately, i really enjoy chatting to you but have been busy with work.... hope to catch up soon"
"

I thought it was a lame excuse and wasnt happy that she was ignoring me before and took so long to get back to me, and i reckon she was lying.

So i got a bit angry and sent this txt 8 hours after she sent me that text. I sent her this:
"In 8 days you couldn't find 1 minute 2 text me back? Why do you never return my calls? Why do did you leave me hanging friday and not at least get back to me that you couldn't make it? I deserve more respect then this, and it seems like you dont respect me"

3 hours later she sends this to me:
"Im really sorry about that i just wasn't ready for anythin more than frienship n it seemed like it was heading that way with the fancy dinners... that friday i was pumped but the royal wedding n forgot thyat i handnt msged you and got busy with work after... i respect you a lot and hope that u know thats true"

I responded with this:

"Thats cool (girls name). I appreciate ur honesty.. i still respect you and want you to understand that i do do not have any bad feelings towards you. I honestly thought you wanted a 2 be more then friends when you told me you wanted to cook for me, that you wanted to go travelling with me and that your goal was 2 have a partner and companion. Are you trying to 2 tell me that you only want 2 be friends, or are you trying to take things slow with me? Either way i wont be offended, just want to know if we are on the same page."

I then feel really bad about the aggressive message i sent her and send this txt 15 minutes later (yeah i know stupid move):

"Sorry last text 4 2nite im sorry sending you that harsh txt (girls name). I had no right 2 talk 2 you like that"

She then sends me this txt:

"Thanks 4 that (my name), i really appreciate that. I enjoy your company and im sorry if i led you to think i want a relationship so quickly. Lets hangout as friends 4 now and see how things go"

I just sent her this txt msg:
"Thank you (girls name), first understand you did nothing wrong, and im sorry i made this awkward 4 u. Lets start fresh, just hang out and have fun. Give me a buzz wen u want 2 catch up. Enjoy your day (girls name)."

anyway her response was this:
"Great idea (my name) thanks 4 being so understanding"

It escalated when you tried to kiss her. It was already waaaaaaay to late. I have been in that position 200 times. I am not the casanova here, on the contrary. But I can tell when women are not interested in a romantic relationship and I could tell she would reject you 100% certain. Because I have made all the mistakes you have made

Also, texting about feelings is a way to run away from personal confrontation. Insecurity, fear. And she smells it and wants a confident guy that tells her what is really going on.
You sent her angry messages because you were afraid to tell her in person. I've done that too.

After being in your spot, I tried to still see her because of the feelings. Lying to myself about my intentions." Let's still be friends".
My personal truth is that I can not be friends with girls I had feelings for, ever. Because they come back. And there will be a time when she has someone else. A guy that doesn't do all the effort you are doing.
And you will think "**** this shit why does she like this douche" and torture yourself

So in order to get over this, I suggest you keep a distance. You already want to catch up again and I think I know why. Hope I'm wrong.
You can never be her genuine friend, certainly not now because you still have these emotions. And she should realize that and not keep using you as the "girl friend" that keeps listening to her. But again, you are offering this to her by offering to "start fresh". Stop doing that and leave

You said you appreciated her "honesty". She hasn't been dishonest with you at this point, but it is dishonest to keep using your attention now she knows you are in love. Women try to suppress this thought for themselves so they still have your attention.
Have some self respect and SHUT DOWN THE ATTENTION CRANE

I don't say you have to be an ass, you can still be nice to her when you meet her. But don't look for her and text her. Get over this, meet other girls and give THEM your attention. She's had her chance and missed out.

She might get pissed and not understand why she doesn't see you anymore. She does understand. It is just a painful loss for her, your attention is gone. So stop offering it to her for Gods sake

Maybe other guys in your position still have contact with her. But that is because they still have feelings and do not intend to be friends. They think her feelings will change but they won't.
There is NOTHING for you to gain from being friends with her. And once you have your friend ticket, you'll never lose it. Don't hope it will change by still seeing her and making effort

I swore not to post on this forum again because women disagree, but I can tell you that's how it goes. You do not have any chance with her any longer

[MynameisJesus]

My question is, is there still hope, and if there is, what now??? Wold waiting another week and asking for a casual meet up in the city to hang out be too soon for me?

No there really isn't. Stop lieing to yourself.
You lied to yourself again when you said " let's start fresh again"

You, me, and the girl all know your intentions. She'll settle for your "friendship" because she likes it. But you'll never ever be her lover regardless of what you still try.
Ditch her. Say hi when you run into her, but don't look for her.

And stop the lame texts like that one about the cat, still begging for her presence.

GAME OVER

[The Crimson Kin]

Hey thanks for your advice MynameisJesus

I appreciate your honesty.

I honestly thought that perhaps she might have been telling me to go slow, start off as friends and see where things go when she was saying "lets hang out as friends and see how things go", a few of my friends who have girlfriends started off as hanging out as friends.... but i guess i maybe thought wrong and was getting too hopeful..

I honestly was thinking that perhaps i organize the first meet up, get the awkwardness out of the way and start having fun, and then after that let her do the majority of the chasing up, basically go into it with no hope or expectations and see how i go, that way i can learn more about her and what she truely about. Dangerous game but i think i can avoid getting hurt or cut up about it. I wont be her emotional tampon

But you are right about the other facts, i made so many mistakes that i deserve to be in this situation. If she did care for me the slightest then she should be able to understand that people make mistakes....

[The Crimson Kin]

Btw, she stopped brining up her ex boyfriend after our first "date"

[MynameisJesus]

And here's a general advice.

She might say " I'm sure you'll make some girl really happy one day. You are such a sweet guy "

I've been told that too, 5 years ago. Being sweet is not the way to go. That is one big lie
Women say they want a nice guy that loves her. Let me make a comparison to make you understand why they say that

A dog makes it very clear that he wants the cookie (a metaphore for your attention). He really wants that, no lie. This forum is full of cookielovers
What you have been doing by being nice, is throwing a whole package of cookies to the dog (texts, calls compliments whatever)

What happens is that she'll take you for granted. Knowing you'll throw cookies anyway. You are still begging for her affection, saying you'll throw more cookies at her in the future.
And you will, you are already offering her new cookies by "starting fresh" (I have a whoooole new package for you!!!) and sending her texts like " I have seen a cat that looks like you"

You think throwing cookies makes her feel good. It does, for a few days. And then she has a sore stomach and gets enough of it. She won't think of you again because she knows you give her unlimited cookies anyway.
And you have to realize that she wants the cookies (attention) and not you as a person. Women crave for attention.

Here's the deal.

In order to be in a real relationship, you have to be careful with throwing cookies. Stop feeding her

Only throw one at her when she has deserved one. Make her work for it.

It is like the relationship between a dog owner and the dog itself.
If you reward the dog for everything by throwing cookies all over the place, you get a dog that doesn't listen to you.
Just like dogs, women want a challenge too. You are no challenge to her, but a an oasis of the attention that she likes.

If you do not give the cookie. The dog will bark.

Concretely she would say " How come I don't see you anymore?? Why don't you text anymore?? "

--> I WANT YOUR COOKIES
--> I NEED YOU TO GIVE IT TO ME

And that's how she'll fall in love. You have to make her wonder what you really think of her.
" Why am I not getting his attention anymore? Is he seeing someone else? "
She'll start thinking about you more and more, and if you have a chance with her this is how attraction escalates

But remember, it is not possible to still change this dog. Her estimation of you is already made. The guy that always agrees and twists and turns in every direction to feel appreciated.
You need to remember this for the future. Once the dog knows you deliver unlimited cookies ( the friend that's always there no matter what), you are completely done.

I order to make a woman fall in love with you, be very very careful with your cookies.
Make her desire the cookies. Don't throw them all over the place hoping that she'll love you for it. She won't

You get short term love for giving her ten cookies per day (texts, calls, " hell you look good in that dress", " let me pay for your drink ")
What happened is that you got a big fat dog now. The dog needs a very long diet now, so ditch this one. Seriously.
Plenty of other dogs on the market, and it's gonna take you a whole lot of work to get rid of this ones habits

Be very careful with your cookies next time when you meet a new dog, from the start. Even though she will beg for cookies all the time, don't give in and be a good boss

What women really want, is a guy that makes her wonder if he loves her or not. One that gives a cookie every 2 days and not 10 per day. And more importantly, a man that loves other dogs as well. So they know they really have to do a good job to get a cookie from you. Just like dogs, women look for a challenge. You aren't offering any of that at the moment

That is how you get into her head. You are constantly giving her confirmation now, which is why you are a friend.
Therefore you take all the mystery away from you and kill all the attraction she could feel for you.

[MynameisJesus]

I honestly was thinking that perhaps i organize the first meet up, get the awkwardness out of the way and start having fun, and then after that let her do the majority of the chasing up, basically go into it with no hope or expectations and see how i go, that way i can learn more about her and what she truely about. Dangerous game but i think i can avoid getting hurt or cut up about it. I wont be her emotional tampon

But you are right about the other facts, i made so many mistakes that i deserve to be in this situation. If she did care for me the slightest then she should be able to understand that people make mistakes....

Dear Crimson.

You do a lot of organising. You are always the one that texts, asks for dates.
Try to think of the metaphore with the dog.

You have to stop giving her so much attention. And even then, I believe you have already lost this case.
Playing her friend and then hoping that her feelings will change, is the worst strategy.
You WILL get hurt. I've done that too and it doesn't allow you to get the closure you need to forget about her.

You are hurt right now, and you want her presence to heal the wound. Playing her friend is the way to get there
That is what feels best for you, but it is the worst thing you can do. It's lieing to yourself

You are not to blame in this, so there is no need to apologize. Not to me, not to her or to yourself.
But you have to understand what you are doing. Battle your intuïtion that says "give in"

The organising you do for her, is because your intuïtion tells you " The more effort I make, the more likely I am going to have a chance with her"
That is not true. Women want a strong, independant man, but you depend on her because you are madly in love.

If she is goodlooking, all guys make an effort for her. And the one that doesn't give in is the most attractive for her

[Dune]

All this talk about cookies.. Where does the milk fit in??

[smackie9]

All this talk about cookies.. Where does the milk fit in??

Just like the saying goes "Why buy the cow when you can get the milk for free". She knows she doesn't have to have a sexual relationship in order to get attention. Screw that!

[jb1111983]

Yeah girls are like (female) dogs. Lol
love your parable about the dog and the cookies, Mr. Jesus. May Christ bless you.