Mac vs PC - Which is better? / Anyone got Vista?

[Chimeros0]

If you could give the names of the studios your talking about Tiay,I could form a better opinion,knowing what the final result looks like Vs what they used.

I was also stating that a PC is better for higher level work in my industry,which is Film,Media & Advertising.

A Mac just doesn't cut the mustard in my books I'm afraid.
Time is money & I can't wait a decade to process my work.
It has nothing to do with the "driver",but more to do with the car ( which we are comparing ).

Please also consider that as one uses a Mac for an extended period of time,they may discover/learn they want/need more.
More capabilities,more software compliances,better graphics,etc.
Next step in line to suit that need is an upgradeable/customizable PC.

I think that is possibly why the PC is more accepted amongst users.
It's the eventual choice.

[Tiay]

Maybe not, But I have seen MACS and you have not seen my PC. Plus, we are tying to decide which one is better so then we would need facts to compare...

ahhh, I see. so you have decided that *your* setups is 'best'. odd, I decide that my setup is best. lilwing would decide his is best. do you see how it is not that one of us is right, and everyone else wrong, but that we all have the setup suited to each particular person?

and you bring up something as opinionated as looks? ....seriously...looks aside since they are opinion you can do more on a PC then a MAC...plain and simple..

my mac does everything I want to do. That is enough for me. If you want to do things that you couldn't do on a mac (name some of those many many things that you do on your PC that would be impossible on a mac, please) then you should get sometheing else, which is suited to you. Personal preference, you see?
Also, you may not value looks but I do. again, personal preference. How often do I have to say that?

btw, please tell me what mysterious acronym MAC stands for?

Not to mention that they have cases that look EXACTLY like the MAC ones for the PC..so I can have it look just like yours ..except do more cause it is a PC. The amount of software available for the PC is ten times that of the MAC.

there's just as little point making a PC look like a Mac as there is running windows on a mac, imo. More software doesn't mean "do more" for everyone- because it's about personal preference. Do PC laptops come in with a built in camera? Not any I know. There's something somebody might value more than a thousand apps or the ability to do certain other things. personal prefe.. whatever. you get it.

If you could give the names of the studios your talking about Tiay,I could form a better opinion,knowing what the final result looks like Vs what they used.

*radio* studios, so it doesn't look like anything. somewhere in germany, but I have no idea what they're called sorry..

I was also stating that a PC is better for higher level work in my industry,which is Film,Media & Advertising.

A Mac just doesn't cut the mustard in my books I'm afraid.
Time is money & I can't wait a decade to process my work.
It has nothing to do with the "driver",but more to do with the car ( which we are comparing ).

oh for crying out LOUD! My point was, the fact that one setup is best for a certain thing does not make it "best" over all. Your structure for "comparing" values the things that YOU value in a computer. those things are not the same for everyone. You may put cars on a racetrack and declare the F1 the winner. someone else may put them on a country track and declare the 4x4 the winner. This debate is as ridiculous as watching the 4x4 guy and the F1 guy argue relentlessly about which is better, when they are simply suited to different situations.

There is no overall "best" because it depends on the requirements. Is your PC the best choice for you? yes. would it also suit my mom? Hell no! that is all I am saying.

Please also consider that as one uses a Mac for an extended period of time,they may discover/learn they want/need more.
More capabilities,more software compliances,better graphics,etc.
Next step in line to suit that need is an upgradeable/customizable PC.

I think that is possibly why the PC is more accepted amongst users.
It's the eventual choice.

no, it isn't. I have used Macs for years. I'm used to the GUI, and it does everything I need. I can't see myself switching. Why? cos it's my freakin' personal preference!

(edit: btw, I know someone who switched from being an big Mac-hater and avid PC user to now using Macs. He worked at Intel, now he's head engineer.. computer technician person at caterpillar)

I'm not telling you that PC's are crap and eventually you will switch to the goodness that is a Mac. 'cos it isn't like that and you wouldn't; It'd just make you angry. So don't force your preference on me or tell me that i'm a deluded idiot who will eventually switch to what you consider 'best', it pisses me off, and I think it would piss you off too if I was telling you the same thing.

[Only-virgins]

But I can do everything you can and more. Don't you get it? For every visual and musical program for the MAC there is a one just like it for the PC...most of the time it is even better...the thing is that everything I can do...some of it you can't. Like play half life 2 for example..cause it doesn't exist for the MAC... i know i know..it is just a game but this is just ONE example. "Setups" have statistical power, my 8800GTS will out run the MAC easy. Another thing is I can do everything you can for HALF THE PRICE!

[Tiay]

But I can do everything you can and more. Don't you get it?

I have never, in at least 10 years using macs, thought "damn, I want to do this but there's no mac software for it". that is all that matters to me.

For every visual and musical program for the MAC there is a one just like it for the PC...most of the time it is even better...

oh, there's a better PC version of photoshop? 'cos that is the be all and end all of a visual app for me. If photoshop is suddenly only available on PC, then PC will become the better option for me. Painter was actually available for Mac first btw. (Edit: for 4 years, photoshop was also only available for macs)
Musical programs don't interest me so I don't need them. Garageband is already too complex for what I need, and I'm sure that is kids play in comparison to proper music apps.

the thing is that everything I can do...some of it you can't. Like play half life 2 for example..cause it doesn't exist for the MAC... i know i know..it is just a game but this is just ONE example.

again, that's great for you, but I don't play computer games. Actually, there is only one game I've ever loved, and it now only runs on non pre-OS9 macs, pretty much programmed by one guy by himself, probably less than 400 people ever played it. But the point is, i'm not a gamer and I couldn't care less about half life 2. I didn't know half life existed before a classmate of mine disappeared for a week when HL 2 came out. I'm not saying this and secretly thinking "damn.. playing HL2 would be sweet.." or something. I seriously couldn't care less about games.

"Setups" have statistical power, my 8800GTS will out run the MAC easy. Another thing is I can do everything you can for HALF THE PRICE!

and that's all great.. for you. But you're the Ferrari driver bragging about horsepower to a mom who just wants to bring the kids to school and do the shopping. I seriously could not care less about that.

I have a serious question for you though: apple isn't making an ultra portable laptop right now. The 13.3 macbook is just a tiiiny bit too heavy and big for me. My ibook will do me for the next year at least, but i'm starting to itch for something new; I need something that's 12" or smaller, lighter than 4.9 pounds, and isn't made of crap; I don't have the expertise to describe this in tech details, but you know what I mean; a proper HD, at least 1 gig memory, a matte color accurate screen, must have an optical drive, very small dimensions, will survive at least two years of daily abuse and will still kick ass while simultaneously running CS3 apps. oh, and I don't have the time nor skill to build it myself.
what would you recommend?

[anachronistic]

let me ask you this though, lilwing: if a friend asked you "Hey, you know about computers! I want to get one for the family. never used a computer before. just you know, surfing, email, photos, music.." what would you recommend them? Personally, because I know the kids would download viruses and be downloading music, if it was a PC it'd be full of viruses and spywear within minutes and they wouldn't know how to deal with it, I'd recommend them one of the cheaper macs. ie, macmini with third party monitor, or the 17" imac, or a second hand G4 imac if price is an issue.

i would tell them this:

"Any computer that can access the Internet is capable of viral infection." and then when they're shocked at that answer and don't believe me, I'll use the bigger words and explain to them how and why..

and then I'd offer to build them a computer that would cost them about half as much as a mac for the same amount of power. I can also build a mac computer from scratch.. for LESS than what apple costs, and with better hardware. did i mention that OSX is available for intel chips now? by the way i hate intel chips. too insecure. highly recommend amd. go turion.

i have built computers for friends before. even just acquaintances. just make them buy the parts, and i'll build it for free

[anachronistic]

as far as operating system goes, i wouldn't know what to tell them. i'd show them windows vista and then mac... maybe mandriva linux. and then i'd let them choose what they like the most.

[Gribble]

Tiay, I work with Macs. And I can tell you that they do get viruses. Not as often, granted, but when a Mac gets a virus it's usually toast. There's very little defense in place. I can't tell you how many times I've had to tell grad students that their 30+ page dissertation was gone unless they wanted to mail their HD off to some company and pay through the nose for a chance to recover it.

[anachronistic]

Tiay, I work with Macs. And I can tell you that they do get viruses. Not as often, granted, but when a Mac gets a virus it's usually toast. There's very little defense in place. I can't tell you how many times I've had to tell grad students that their 30+ page dissertation was gone unless they wanted to mail their HD off to some company and pay through the nose for a chance to recover it.

i have yet to see an operating system that is inpenetrable and invulnerable to everything. ALL operating systems have flaws, and always will. there will always be a way to penetrate.

do you know how easy it is to remotely access a mac? the only downside to this is that root is not defaultly enabled and you have to do a bunch of shit to get access. but when you do get access to a disabled root account, the password is most often BLANK

do you know how easy it is to remotely access windows? 10 times easier oh and especially because the root, or the head admin account that is only accessible through safe mode HAS NO PASSWORD BY DEFAULT. most people aren't aware of this. most people actually don't know there is even a safe mode, thus making their computer a thousand million times more vulnerable... oh and government has backdoor access to every windows copy.

linux, one of the first things you do (one of the most important) is set a password for the root account. this makes you computer invulnerable to many of the viruses out there written to penetrate the lack of password protection. BUT, if someone were to guess your root account, you'd be ****ed because all the system files are just in the highest hierarchy (/)

[Tiay]

"Any computer that can access the Internet is capable of viral infection."

this is, of course, true.

and then I'd offer to build them a computer that would cost them about half as much as a mac for the same amount of power. I can also build a mac computer from scratch.. for LESS than what apple costs, and with better hardware.

hold it, mister, that's cheating. you can't build it for them, though that is very nice of you. Most people don't have a nice friend who'll build them a cheap computer. the point of the question is what would you recommend those regular people who don't have the possibility of building, doing complicated installations, etc. If that same family with the kids and all were going to just buy one from shop, what should they get?

did i mention that OSX is available for intel chips now? by the way i hate intel chips. too insecure. highly recommend amd. go turion.

yeah.. I don't know any mac user who doesn't know about the intel chip by now!
I also dislike the intel chip. and I don't even have any big technical reasons to dislike it.. I just don't really understand why they switched.

i have built computers for friends before. even just acquaintances. just make them buy the parts, and i'll build it for free

oh! can you build me a super light/small but high-powered laptop? seriously.. is that possible?

i have yet to see an operating system that is inpenetrable and invulnerable to everything. ALL operating systems have flaws, and always will. there will always be a way to penetrate.

yes, I agree.

do you know how easy it is to remotely access a mac? the only downside to this is that root is not defaultly enabled and you have to do a bunch of shit to get access. but when you do get access to a disabled root account, the password is most often BLANK

ah, I see. yeah, I believe the guest account I have for my mom on my ibook has a pretty simple pw. but by default it can do almost nothing. This is my own fault though!

do you know how easy it is to remotely access windows? 10 times easier oh and especially because the root, or the head admin account that is only accessible through safe mode HAS NO PASSWORD BY DEFAULT.

hehe.. that's.. why? why did nobody think to give it a pw by default?

linux, one of the first things you do (one of the most important) is set a password for the root account. this makes you computer invulnerable to many of the viruses out there written to penetrate the lack of password protection. BUT, if someone were to guess your root account, you'd be ****ed because all the system files are just in the highest hierarchy (/)

hm, I actually find this pretty interesting. I don't usually deal with stuff like this, so I hardly know anything about it, but I do understand it once someone explains it like that.

Tiay, I work with Macs. And I can tell you that they do get viruses. Not as often, granted, but when a Mac gets a virus it's usually toast. There's very little defense in place. I can't tell you how many times I've had to tell grad students that their 30+ page dissertation was gone unless they wanted to mail their HD off to some company and pay through the nose for a chance to recover it.

whatever that was, it very probably wasn't a real mac virus. Yes, there have been "proof-of-concept" "viruses" for mac. well.. one that I know of. but it never replicated itself effectively and only infected like 50 computers. I doubt your student's computers were affected.
btw.. these dissertations.. were they written in word by any chance? Because i've read this can happen when moving an infected .doc between pc and mac, it can still affect the .doc on the mac.

If you google something like OSX Virus, you'll probably get a bunch of different things claiming the honour of being "the FIRST EVER mac virus". but they are not true viruses. These things are not even active. And even if there is a handful of mac infections out there, it is nothing in comparison. A PC will get infected within days of being in the internet. My family have been online for.. 7 or 8 years I think? no viruses or infections, ever, even with pre-OS9 systems, and no loss of data beyond loosing unsaved changes in a document. There is no way that could've happened if we had had PCs.

I was chatting to a friend on AIM recently, (she has a mac) and suddenly she disappeared off the chat. next time I saw her she was like "oh i'm SO sorry, i hope you didn't think I just left! it's just that there was a guest in the house and he wanted to check his online banking account in a hurry." ..This guy had checked her boyfriends PC laptop, saw that it had pretty much every current virus and spyware on it, and so he used her macbook, which he didn't even check for spywear first.

On a sidenote tho, I agree that this is a possible weakness. That is, if there suddenly was active spywear for mac that infected a significant number, people might not be wary of it. However, there'd be so much talk about it on the internet, it'd be hard to miss.

In fact, I remember hearing about a company that makes virus protection for mac releasing a statement basically admitting that there was no use for their software, except as a "just in case" thing. the only people buying the software would be either paranoid, or businesses that have a policy of getting virus protection and were thus forced to buy something.

[Chimeros0]

Sorry tiay,it doesn't seem like anyone else that has posted shares your opinion about Mac's.
We need more Mac pro opinions...

As for different type cars ( e.g.4x4 VS family wagon ), we are talking about Mac's & PC's doing there jobs.
Processing does not require me to "drive",or worry about "terrain",only the computer to do its job with what I have given it.

Power is the issue!

As with a more powerful PC,it does not cripple a "standard" user ( the operating system might do that ) it speeds up whatever the user is doing.Nor does it become "overcomplicated" unless your doing something "more".
As for the virus ordeal.If enough people used Mac's,I can assure you,there would be enough hackers & viruses to make protection software applicable to Mac's.Truth is nobody has bothered,as Mac's aren't popular enough.

I simply ask this Tiay:"Would you, as a person that uses internet,prefer 56K dial up or broadband/cable to do your internet tasks,etc.?"

[anachronistic]

hold it, mister, that's cheating. you can't build it for them, though that is very nice of you. Most people don't have a nice friend who'll build them a cheap computer. the point of the question is what would you recommend those regular people who don't have the possibility of building, doing complicated installations, etc. If that same family with the kids and all were going to just buy one from shop, what should they get?

great comic tiay.

how is it cheating? you asked me what i would tell a *friend*

for someone on the street that asks for a recommendation, of a prebuilt pc with a system and all already assembled, i wouldn't know what to say, because i don't look at prebuilt computers. As far as operating systems, i'd recommend Windows XP (because of software issues with vista), OSX Tiger, and Mandrivalinux.

Believe it or not, mandriva is a linux distro that's designed for a person who only wants to surf the net and all that other superficial crap. you got your music and chat programs and browsers and everything else you could ask for. it's kinda like OSX, the terminal is tucked away in the back, but the root user is enabled. 24 hour help, and a very well written help guide. it's got a cool looking interface, too! kde isn't my favorite though.... i like the gnome environment.

[anachronistic]

Sorry tiay,it doesn't seem like anyone else that has posted shares your opinion about Mac's.
We need more Mac pro opinions...

As for different type cars ( e.g.4x4 VS family wagon ), we are talking about Mac's & PC's doing there jobs.
Processing does not require me to "drive",or worry about "terrain",only the computer to do its job with what I have given it.

Power is the issue!

As with a more powerful PC,it does not cripple a "standard" user ( the operating system might do that ) it speeds up whatever the user is doing.Nor does it become "overcomplicated" unless your doing something "more".
As for the virus ordeal.If enough people used Mac's,I can assure you,there would be enough hackers & viruses to make protection software applicable to Mac's.Truth is nobody has bothered,as Mac's aren't popular enough.

I simply ask this Tiay:"Would you, as a person that uses internet,prefer 56K dial up or broadband/cable to do your internet tasks,etc.?"

'power' is dependent upon the hardware that builds the computer. macs are faster now, because they use intel chips instead of powerpc. why did they switch to intel? better performance. actually, just faster speed, and worse performance.

putting an intel chip into a mac and crossbreeding through rosetta is like putting a v10 engine in a gocart; it goes really ****in' fast, but just how stable is it? exactly.

amd chips are the most secure because their bus is longer. i'm not going to go into specific detail, because most of you know nothing about that. amd is just more secure than intel.. and powerpc is close to amd, just a hell lot slower.

another simple analogy that you may understand: AMD is to fully equipped army tank as intel is to gocart with v10 engine in it.

now if both of these vehicles were about to crash into eachother head on, which would you want to be in?

[Chimeros0]

Thanks Lilwing,your the only one that seems to know what his talking about when it comes to Mac's & PC's.

What is power if it cannot be controlled? It's useless! So go for a stable & safe setup that does its job effortlessly.

I also use & prefer AMD.
They rock the house with their over clocking chip sets & layouts.
Can't wait to see what the merger with ATI has in store for future motherboards & graphic cards...

Go into detail if you have to Lilwing,there are allot of people that read these posts & need facts rather then B*ll S*it.

[anachronistic]

Thanks Lilwing,your the only one that seems to know what his talking about when it comes to Mac's & PC's.

What is power if it cannot be controlled? It's useless! So go for a stable & safe setup that does its job effortlessly.

I also use & prefer AMD.
They rock the house with their over clocking chip sets & layouts.
Can't wait to see what the merger with ATI has in store for future motherboards & graphic cards...

Go into detail if you have to Lilwing,there are allot of people that read these posts & need facts rather then B*ll S*it.

i don't like ati graphics cards either. pretty much the same reason and the fact that they're not very compatible with linux distros. i like the nvidia geforce 9550. it's sexy

if anyone posts a question, i'm willing to answer, so bring em out bring em out

[Tiay]

Thanks Lilwing,your the only one that seems to know what his talking about when it comes to Mac's & PC's.

yeah, lilwing, you're great.* I just suck. thanks chim. You act like it makes me an idiot just because I'm not as knowledgeable about this particular thing as you.

*: this part isn't sarcasm.

putting an intel chip into a mac and crossbreeding through rosetta is like putting a v10 engine in a gocart; it goes really ****in' fast, but just how stable is it? exactly.

god bless car analogies.